korn101
Hi all,
I'm looking to get my first tube amp. I play a CV50's Stratocaster. I play mostly blues.. Mainly Hendrix, and a lot of David Gilmour (pink floyd) stuff. I practice in my study, where I can play fairly loud if I want - I usually keep my cube 30x at around 1/2 to 3/4 volume when practicing. But I would like to gig and play medium venues.
I've narrowed my search to a second hand Fender Blues Junior OR a Peavey Classic 30 OR a Peavey Classic 50 1/12
I played a Blues Junior Tweed version with the upgraded speaker, and the clean channel was SWEET. I really liked the sparkly tones.
I did some research, and almost everyone recommends the PV classic 30/50 over the Blues Junior. Although I have yet to play the classic 30. As far as cleans I know the PV is more like a Bassman, and the Fender Blues Junior more like a blackface fender. As to the whole blackface vs tweed debate, I really love the blackface shimmering sparkly cleans. But I also really like the warm tweed tone.
After all the research i'm really leaning towards the PV Classic. And would like to know whether to go for the 30 watt or the 50 watt (twin) - The 50 watt seems like a much better investment with having more features (bright channel, presence, standby switch, cooling fan for tubes, and probably most importantly - the master volume control.) But I'm really scared that I will have to crank the 50 too high to get the sweet tube tone i'm looking for. But for now, any tube sounds better than my roland to my ears, even the Marshall MA50c, which is somewhat stale sounding compared to the other tube amps I've played.
Thoughts and suggestions welcome ?
Thanks in advance ?
singemonkey
See the other debates on this issue.
I will, as usual, strongly recommend that you do not go for the 50Watt. Nothing sounds better for blues overdrive than natural power-amp distortion. There isn't a pedal in the world that can match it. To get it, you have to turn the power amp (master volume) up, up, up. You'll find even the 30Watt will be too loud for most venues at these levels (tube amps are much louder than transistor amps at the same power rating). But at very least, 30watts will more than do you. Bigger venues must mic up guitar amps. It's not 1965 anymore, and PA systems do the heavy lifting at these sorts of gigs.
A 30Watt will easily give you cleans at volume, but in some venues you'll also have the option of turning it right up and letting those power tubes glow.
makepeace
Not sure how helpful this is going to be for your life, but I say go look around a bit more. Venture forth and play some amps. Not at shops necessarily. Have a skim through the classifieds +/ gumtree. Don't be scared to veer from the cobbled path of Fenders and the usuals. Watch some demos - use the google machine. Investigate some of the local builders offerings too.
+1 to not a 50W. You'll probably find 30W will be pushing it for your applications as too.
VellaJ
Hey Korn ?
I have the Peavey ValveKing 112, which is kinda a slightly more "metal" version of the Classic 50 (the VK112 is also a 50 Watter). When they say the 50W is too loud, they ain't lyin'. If I play my amp on volume 4, I could nigh drown out our drummer...
Look, I play mine with the volume way down low, obviously, but I'm still pretty happy with the sound I get out of it without cranking the power amp. Something I do need to say, is if the Classic is anything like the ValveKing, you're going to want that "bright" switch. Without it, the sound can be really muddy...
Quality wise, the Peavey is top notch. I adore my amp. My personal advice would be to check out the sound of the Classic 30, if you say it doesn't have all the features of the 50. If it sounds good to you, that would be the best choice, in my humble opinion...
Dingwall
My 2p is don't think you have to start at 30w, try lower watt amps as you can push them harder and if the amp is quality this will always sound better. I think I read somewhere is that to get best tone from an amp you should run it at 3/4 volume. My first serious amp was a Marshall JCM 100w stack - I ended up having to play it at very low volumes which defeated the purpose!
So try a 30w at 3/4 and I think you will find it is quite loud and unless you are playing large venues, probably too much!
I use an 18w combo and it is plenty loud enough - not quite 'big' enough for me tho so I am currently considering going for a 2x12 option but keeping the wattage low!
Finally another option is an amp that can vary it's wattage, some switch from 30w to 15w to say 7w. This seems to make sense although not yet tried out any.
epictring
30watt - no question. 30 watt is already too loud
MoJo-JoJoe
Both amps you're looking at use EL84 power tubes. For your description of the tones you're looking for, I'd be inclined towards 6L6's or more likely 6V6's. The 2 amps that come to mind are the Fender SuperChamp XD (though it has a modelling front-end and only the power amp is tube) and the Ibanez TSA-15. Both these amps will give you that blackface sparkle as apposed to the chimey tones of EL84's. I've owned a number of Blues Jnr's and they are really nice, but really not too "blackface" sounding. I also have owned the SuperChamp XD and currently a TSA-15, so I have first-hand long-term exposure to them all (except the Classic 30 which I have not owned, but the other guitarist in a band I played in for years played one). My first choice (in keeping within similar price bracket) of this bunch would actually be the SuperChamp XD based on your requirements ... as long as you can get your head around the fact that the pre-amp uses models.
Hope that helps a bit ....
ZarK
15-30 watts tube power is more than enough. Tube amps sound so much better when you can really drive them... Personally if it has 6l6 tubes and a Vintage 30 I'm usually all over it... This combo offers me both the sparkling cleans as well as the crunch and high-gain tones that I prefer. I haven't spent much time with a classic 30, but I believe they are very decent amplifiers...
korn101
Thanks for all the replies guys. ? the classic 50 was quite out of the way anyway. So this weekend I'll take a look at the Classic 30 that is for sale close to where I stay. I will still try play a 50 and see if I really need the bright and other functions. I will also make sure to re-visit that blues junior tweed once again just to make sure. Although I've noticed that second hand tweed blues juniors are very hard to find... Keep the advice rolling in ?
singemonkey
Just a note on the superchamp xd. Great sounding amp, but a single 10" speaker tends to get lost at gigs. I don't know if there's a 12" version. Otherwise for gigs you may find yourself needing an external speaker cabinet.
One option to really consider: musiciansfriend sells used stuff internationally. Furthermore, incredibly, they ship any item over $500 for free - a forum member has already imported a combo amp (probably about 25kg+) without paying any shipping. A really good option to consider there would be the Egnater Rebel 30 combo, which offers use of different valve options for a Fender-y vs. Marshall-y sound, and power scaling, so that you don't have to run it at the full 30W. If one of those guys comes up on musiciansfriend, it might be a great option for you.
arjunmenon
MoJo JoJoe wrote:
Both amps you're looking at use EL84 power tubes. For your description of the tones you're looking for, I'd be inclined towards 6L6's or more likely 6V6's. The 2 amps that come to mind are the Fender SuperChamp XD (though it has a modelling front-end and only the power amp is tube) and the Ibanez TSA-15. Both these amps will give you that blackface sparkle as apposed to the chimey tones of EL84's. I've owned a number of Blues Jnr's and they are really nice, but really not too "blackface" sounding. I also have owned the SuperChamp XD and currently a TSA-15, so I have first-hand long-term exposure to them all (except the Classic 30 which I have not owned, but the other guitarist in a band I played in for years played one). My first choice (in keeping within similar price bracket) of this bunch would actually be the SuperChamp XD based on your requirements ... as long as you can get your head around the fact that the pre-amp uses models.
Hope that helps a bit ....
+1 to the above. 30 - 50w way too much.
I'm currently using a 5w mic'd up that's plenty loud, drives well with nice punch & clarity.
Norman86
Try an Albion combo too..
TCT35Combo... around the same price as the others too..
Let me qualify...
6L6 tubes, 12" speaker, power scaling to around 12 watts, fender clean type channel;, marshally high gain channel...
and still less than R5k retail as far as i know..
greetings
I had a Classic 30. Great amp, but don't get it. It is LOUD. And I mean LOUD. I wouldn't go more than 15 watts, and preferably an amp with variable wattage.
I also use a 5 watt amp. In my opinion, two 5 watt amps in stereo are all I could ever need with modern PA systems.
The Blackheart Little Giant is a very good option in the 5w range (also has a 12" speaker), but uses EL84 power tubes. As far as 15 watters, the Fender Pro and Blues juniors are nice, but suffer a little from small cab size.
Egnaters are great amps if you can get one.
IceCreamMan
Norman86 wrote:
Try an Albion combo too..
TCT35Combo... around the same price as the others too..
Let me qualify...
6L6 tubes, 12" speaker, power scaling to around 12 watts, fender clean type channel;, marshally high gain channel...
and still less than R5k retail as far as i know..
The Albion will be about 60 % of the Blues jr pricing and less than half the PEavey 30 pricing i reckon.
And i concur with the majoirty here, 50 watts is overkill...30 watts is heading towards overkill territpory too but its nice to have a bit of oomph should it be needed.
Reinhard
Like Singe said, don't go for something with a 10" speaker, unless it has a few of them (4x10 ftw).
Classic 30 is a cool amp, owned one at one time, but like others mentioned, beyond loud. I don't ever see you pushing the amp to tube breakup, I still dont believe that amp is REALLY 30w ? So it comes to reason the 50W would be even more insanely loud.
I have owned a Blues Jr too ages ago, but the Classic 30 may just be a better bet. I really can't remember what it sounded like, but I traded it for a vintage deluxe reverb.
If you do go for a smaller tube amp, just make sure you have enough headroom. My deluxe reverb gets louder to about 4.5 and then just dirtier.
So you can go plenty of headroom with pedals for overdrive (easier IMO and sounds great) or go lower watts and tube OD.
ezietsman
+1 to what Reinhard says.
One thing to note. The Blues Jr will give you overdrive at low volumes because it has a preamp gain control and a master volume, as do most of the other amps mentioned. However, the 'Tube Overdrive' spoken about is the drive from the power tubes, and most amps will be plenty loud when those start driving. My vote will be for a 15Watt combo with less efficient speaker (something like a Greenback or other ~97dB speaker) if you want power tube drive too (it sounds great). You mostly won't be getting any of that at home or at night because of the volume, regardless of speaker or wattage choice (unless its like 1 watt or so).
If you are happy to, or want to use pedals for your overdrive, then your choices are expanded to louder amps like the Classic 30/Albion TC35 etc. That said, I played a Blues Jr III the other day and it was great, but not for the price they were selling it for.
Singemonkey gigs my 18 watt amp with an efficient 2x12, mostly unmicd, and it is plenty loud when scaled down to the less than 10 watt he uses it at.
nick
Reinhard wrote:
Like Singe said, don't go for something with a 10" speaker, unless it has a few of them (4x10 ftw).
Agreed, but strangely enough I find the Class5 to not sound like a 10" amp
korn101
I may be leaning towards the Albion TCT35... They might be a better bet, and considering my close friend's dad has some kind of contact.. He gets them in for real cheap. Will inquire. Has anyone here had any experience with these? and how do they compare to the Blues JNR and Classic 30 ?
BTW Thought I'd just add: My budget is ~5000
arjunmenon
korn101 wrote:
I may be leaning towards the Albion TCT35... They might be a better bet, and considering my close friend's dad has some kind of contact.. He gets them in for real cheap. Will inquire. Has anyone here had any experience with these? and how do they compare to the Blues JNR and Classic 30 ?
BTW Thought I'd just add: My budget is ~5000
Well, there's an Ibanez TSA15 and cab in the classifieds section going for 3500.
From having played one, i found that it has a very punchy clean channel, is 2 x 6V6 based and is switchable between 15 & 5 watts.
Plus it has the Tubescreamer circuit built in and an additional boost function.
Just putting it out there...
I would have bought it if finance wasn't an issue.
