Intonation/string length adjustment

Werner232

Hi guys! ? Me again! ? I need some advice. I've sorted out the grounding problem on the Flying V I'm building. I slapped on some Ernie Ball's regular slinky and started adjusting the intonation using my various books and videos I've managed to collect for the build.

Everything is fine except my bottom E string. I get a F# on my 12th , 13th and 14th fret.

I checked the truss rod and it is fine. Frets are all level. Nut slot depths ate all correct.

What can be the problem? :-\

Ibanezguy

Hey Werner, as its only one string, it sounds like either a fret is way too high i.e the 15th under the E string, or you have a nasty kink in the E string.
Is your neck pick up not too high maybe?? Sorry just trying to think of everything LOL ?

morph

At first I thought it could have been intonation but now I it sounds like the 14th Fret is too high, If you look from the side and slowly press down the string on 12th you should see it touch the 14th fret first

Werner232

I tried to adjust the saddle. The closest I can get on the 12th fret is F. Which gives me the idea that the string was put on too short.

Werner232

Meaning I should have extended it a bit more before I wound it around the capstan on the tuning machine.

morph

I have seen this before on an acoustic guitar, the High E string also went up normally to about the 10th fret, then from the 11 up to the 13th it gave F. After that it was fine again. When I looked at the neck there was a distinct dip in the neck at those frets. This was a cheap guitar and there was no fix for this.

Hopefully yours is simply a high fret that can be seated deeper.

morph

Werner232 wrote: Meaning I should have extended it a bit more before I wound it around the capstan on the tuning machine.

The note you hear is a function of the distance from bridge at the back to the nut at the front or to the fret when then string is pushed down and the tension applied to the string. There is no difference in the amount of string you wind around the tuning head.

V8

Wern, I'd eyeball the guitar for you, but it's a bit of a drive - So, any advice below may or may not help.

So assuming the the neck is not warped or twisted in any way, frets are level and nicely seated & nut height is fine :

1. and the string frets cleanly everywhere...then you might have a dodgy string - it happens occasionally when one uses the cheaper (Ashton/Dadi) strings - it's a bit rarer if it's a brand name string. I had a dud strings in the last set I cheap I used and a set of elixir's a while back. Dud strings sound dead, don't hold a tuning that well & just don't intonate.

2. but there are fretting issues around a certain point (and you are sure it isn't a errant fret...0.2mm can make a huge difference here) and the neck doesn't look twisted or warped...then I might be inclined to check the neck pocket and the angle the neck is sitting in the body. Tiny adjustments here can make major differences on the relationship between the string & fretboard.

Ideally the neck will sit perfectly flush in the neck pocket - in practice, some guitars (usually cheaper ones) can benefit from a little shim to adjust the neck angle. (I usually find a small piece of sandpaper functioning as the shim).

Kinda reminded me when someone brought me a clunker DIY project to restring. This thing wouldn't intonate - no matter how I approached it. Couple hours later I figured out they had bashed a squire neck (25.5 in scale) onto a LP style body (24.5in scale) and not checked if they would have to move the bridge on the body to compensate for the extra length of the neck.

Foottapiologist

This snippet probably doesn't apply in this instance but is intonation related. I had persistent inexplicable intonation problems with an acoustic guitar till I noticed that the nut was fitted ever so slightly skew. Angled in relation to the fretboard much like a saddle but by a ball hair barely noticeable to the naked eye. I thought I was imagining it so measured with a vernier. Very careful DIY solved it.

Werner232

Hi guys. I found the problem. I re-checked everything and lo and behold. My 13th fret is a fraction too high. I re adjusted the saddle and manged to get it to F. I re-checked the other strings and everything is fine on them. So it seems that I'm gonna have to file the fret or have it pressed again.

A penny for your thoughts please.

Gearhead

One of the few problems in life that can actually be solved with a hammer ?

V8

Gearhead wrote: One of the few problems in life that can actually be solved with a hammer ?

Wern, try tapping the offending down to reseat the fret. Then check height again and file offending fret if necessary (and re-crown). If it was more than one fret. you'd want to make a fret sanding beam.

I'm far from professional with fret work (crowning frets...ack!), but this helped :

Werner232

Thanks for the advice guys. ?

Ibanezguy

Dont hit the fret directly with a hammer lol ? This will make the crowning job much more intensive than necessary.
Use a piece of wood on top of the fret and make sure the string doesn't interfere and get in the way or you will end up tapping an nasty little dent into your fret- i speak from experience :'(
PS make sure the neck is supported from underneath at the point you will be tapping the fret.

Werner232

Thanks guys! I took a deadblow Mallet and just tapped the fret a few times. Now I'm sorted! ?

V8

Werner232 wrote: Thanks guys! I took a deadblow Mallet and just tapped the fret a few times. Now I'm sorted! ?

So how about a pic of this beastie?

Werner232

I'll post a few as soon as I have figured out how! Lol! ?

V8

Werner232 wrote: I'll post a few as soon as I have figured out how! Lol! ?

Courtesy of Norio...

http://www.guitarforum.co.za/how-to/how-to-post-pictures-t4055/msg271004/#new