Rabbit
Hi Everyone!
First post from me, and sadly, I am probably going to cement my reputation as a twit right from the beginning! :'(
I got a Vintage VRS100 which I really like, but on taking it to the local luthier, they told me that the neck is twisted (the relief is different for the high and low E strings). Tragic because it is an awesome instrument otherwise. (Apparently, based on what I have seen on the internet and what the local music shop tells me, this is not unusual for the brand Vintage, so be sure to check this before buying one.)
Being unable to sell it in good conscience, I have spent a bunch of time trying to see how I could best set it up. From the beginning the truss rod has been incredibly difficult to turn, so I just assumed that was natural. With hindsight, the combination of the the neck twist and the tight truss rod should have told me all I need to know about attempting to work on it...
The other day, I decided to straighten the neck to try to see how bad the problem is and whether a fret level or a re-fret might help. Long story short, the guitar said "Crack!" really loudly, and now I have a huge uncorrectable back bow. Strangely, adjusting the truss rod allows further back bow, but it is no longer possible to get the neck straight or to get a forward bow.
The guitar is a set neck, so I cannot just replace the neck. Breaking a truss rod is a user error, so the manufacturer cannot be expected to replace the guitar (like I said: I am a twit!). The value of the guitar is less than what it would cost me to have it professionally repaired, so I am on me own!
Which leads to my question: What should I do now?
There are some suggestions on how to repair a truss rod on the internet, some of which involve removing and replacing the fretboard, while others involve cutting through the fretboard. Another option is removing all the frets and planing the neck straight. Are these options something I should attempt? Is there another option? Or should I just sell the parts (pickups, tuning machines, wiring, bridge) and use the body as firewood - which I would obviously much rather not do!
Thanks for reading this! Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
lapdawg
Not sure I understand you. I don't think a broken truss would cause back bow. If it breaks it would relieve tension and the headstock would raise. Are you sure that the sound wasn't wood cracking?
You only likely option would be to get a luthier to salvage the board and head stock and to make a new neck. The head stock could be scarf jointed to the new neck. This job would cost you at least a good few thousand.
You may also ask the vintage agents if they will be able to ship a replacement neck, you can then have it fitted locally.
Nitebob
Firstly...Welcome!
Secondly....Pics always rule!
Some guitars have a tendency to have twisted necks. I'm thinking of some of the late Epiphone acoustics specifically. I only use a SX so I would probably burn it, but in your case..."in for a penny, in for a pound" I would have the neck replaced too. Think it's a mush simpler procedure than to replace only the trussrod and frankly, replacing the trussrod myself is a little unnerving to me. The VRS100C has a set neck, but I'm sure a replacement is obtainable.
Good luck!
IceCreamMan
sounds terminal...I suspect that a new neck and installing it will cost more than a new guitar..... So unless this particular guitar has some intrinsic value to you that goes beyond money yr best financially based decision is to sell what u can and buy another which I have seen second hand from around 2k iirc.
Rabbit
Wow! Thanks for the rapid responses! This forum is clearly far more active than I thought would be!
lapdawg: I also thought that a broken truss rod would give forward bow. Add to that the fact that the back bow can be increased which means that the truss rod still kinda works. But the luthier said that it depends on how the truss rod broke. My initial thought was also that the wood had cracked, but there is narry a mark on the guitar which would indicate a break or crack. But perhaps I should take it to our local clinic and try to convince them to x-ray it - would be interesting if nothing else!
Nitebob: Thanks for the welcome! I was thinking of taking photos, but it is just a guitar with a back-bowed neck... The more I look, the more good things I read about SX - I foresee one in my future! ?
IceCreamMan: You have perfectly summed my problem up! The money to repair it is more than the guitar is worth...
I guess that the consensus is that there is not much that can be done without investing more than a new guitar would cost. So I suppose that there is no harm in some experimentation! After all, it cannot get more broken. ? I will post an update when I have decided what to attempt and found the tone to do it! Until then any other suggestions would be welcome!
Thanks again!
Nitebob
Necks are between R500 and R1100 on ebay, some including shipping...find out what a luthier would ask to replace neck if you supply and take it from there. The question on dumping it, only you can answer....what is the guitar worth to you?
Any money you spend on it, you probably won't get back...does that warrant rather losing the whole amount you paid initially?
Brastep
Rabbit wrote:
I got a Vintage VRS100 which I really like, but on taking it to the local luthier, they told me that the neck is twisted (the relief is different for the high and low E strings). Tragic because it is an awesome instrument otherwise.
This may not help you with your truss rod problem, but if you are ever checking out a guitar again, be aware that some luthiers deliberately profile the fretboard so as to give a greater gap between the frets and the low E string (and other bass strings). This is because the bass strings tend to vibrate in wider arc than the treble strings (esp nylon strung guitars) and may cause buzzing on a completely flat fretboard.
Sighting by eye along the fretboard may give the impression that the neck is twisted. However if you measure the thickness of the fretboard on both sides at the nut, and then again on both side down at the 12th (for eg) you may see how the fretboard has been thinned out by a few mm on the bass side.
About the trussrod... are you sure its broken. These things are generally made of steel rod!!! Although i guess you may have stripped the threads or sumpting. If you want to play around, and if the bow is not too pronounced, you can try removing the frets and replaning the fretboard flat.
But unless is sounds totally shite, leave it as it is!
Rabbit
Thanks again for all the useful input!
Nitebob: I honestly did not realise that necks could be obtained so cheaply. I will definitely look into it!
Brastep: I never thought about different relief, though as you say, it makes perfect sense. But in this case, the neck ran flat from the body until about the fourth out fifth fret and then dipped on the one side and was flat or slightly raised on the other. I do not think it was intentional. But I have learnt something!
I am increasingly wondering whether the truss rod really did break given the feedback here. I think I will take beastie to another luthier for a second opinion...
Norman86
Not sure where you are located, but if i was you, i would contact Costafonix on the forum.
Attila
I got one of them and I love it for what it is (I did change the pickups), however guys are battling to sell these guits at R1500.
The importers are trying to dump their stock at cost.... 3 - 4k no takers - Fact
My hint of the day is ~
The wood is good the Wilkinson hardware is reasonably good as well, Why not make it a project guitar,
You can lift the fret board and replace the truss-rod (which you can buy from TerryD in CT) yourself, that's the easy part.
Sanding the neck straight will take a bit of know how, but not rocket science, - re glue the fret board, and you'er in business.
Mask up the guitar properly before starting so as to preserve the paint work
2c - out
Wizard
Your biggest risk is spending 3k in necks and labour ro restore something you could sell for 1k.
But you now have the perfect learning tool in your hands. You can strip it, rebuild it or do whatever you like without diminishing it's playability at all.
And you'll come out the other side really understanding how things work.
Keira-WitherKay
by the sound of things ....you NOT quite sure what the problem is ....i would say take it to a reputable...note i said reputable guitar repair man and let him tell you whats wrong...and quote on the job...... as someone mentioned you may have just stripped the thread.... or maybe it is terminal but most quotes are free ....but not worth guessing .
and like attilla said if the neck is trashed beyond affordable repair...there's still value in pickup and tuners and electronics, bridge in fact all the hardware .... can be stripped off and used or even sold
or lastly guitars make great wall ornaments .... so hang it on your wall like a piece of art ...might not be playable but it may still look cool
good luck
warrenpridgeon
Keira WitherKay wrote:
by the sound of things ....you NOT quite sure what the problem is ....i would say take it to a reputable...note i said reputable guitar repair man and let him tell you whats wrong...and quote on the job...... as someone mentioned you may have just stripped the thread.... or maybe it is terminal but most quotes are free ....but not worth guessing .
Yep +1
Keira WitherKay wrote:
and like attilla said if the neck is trashed beyond affordable repair...there's still value in pickup and tuners and electronics, bridge in fact all the hardware .... can be stripped off and used or even sold
or lastly guitars make great wall ornaments .... so hang it on your wall like a piece of art ...might not be playable but it may still look cool
good luck
I'm busy conceptualising a box frame with glass front (to keep the dust out as much as possible) to put my Epi Les Paul in and put it on the wall after it got its neck broken. Going to sell the guitar case afterward, which should cover the cost of the build.
Chocklit_Thunda
If you wanna get rid of it, you know where to find me ?
If you're in the Gauteng area that is.
I've been needing a neck to attempt a fretboard removal on ?
lapdawg
Chocklit_Thunda wrote:
If you wanna get rid of it, you know where to find me ?
If you're in the Gauteng area that is.
I've been needing a neck to attempt a fretboard removal on ?
Just done one with a homemade steamer to replace a truss rod. I am not sure that this guitar will have its fretboard glued with a glued with a steamable glue. perhaps worth a try though.
Chocklit_Thunda
I've heard of guys using a regular household iron. Seems to work on guitars of an Asian persuasion ? I think you use steam for hide glue?
I know just plain heat works on white PVA. The heat in Sun City, a car boot and a Cort acoustic showed me that the hard way.
The back bow is significantly better, but it still gives loads of fret buzz with the bridge at its very highest setting. So near and yet, so far... :'( Well, it was worth a shot...