Metal tone...

warrenpridgeon

Hope this is the right place

=

Quite a few interesting points this guy makes... I out band situation, often the guitarists have their amp/pedals set up so that it sounds real good when they jam alone, but when the rest of the band comes in it's like "where'd the guitar go".
When playing I try listen to which frequency range the keyboard is playing and how the bass guitar is jamming and try to play different chord voicings so that we aren't fighting for the same frequency ranges.

After all... as this guy says, the guitarist is the most important and he/she needs to be heard...LOL. But it IS pointless playing and not being heard.

Jayhell

I have explained this to my lead guitarist a million times and he always agrees with me, but he never does anything about it, so now I just call him my other bass guitarist ? Cut those lows, that's why we have a bass guitarist, if you compete with him for frequencies you will always lose.

LooneyAtTheGate

Wise words. Always have different settings for 'bedroom', 'band practice', and 'live'.
For twin-guitars try to use different amps and eq settings to fill different parts of the frequency range.

..said no lead guitarist ever.. ☹

Jayhell

Someone once had a theory that lead guitarists, especially the technical types unconsciously set their tone up in a specific manner so they can hear the technical detail of what they are doing not necessarily to be pleasing to anyone's ears. They then think that this is good because they can hear what they are doing. It's a theory but it makes sense. Now add that to a lead guitarist's ego and plain stubbornness and you have problems. 'Dude, too much lows and you are to loud!', 'But I always play these settings!' Exactly, that's the problem, adjust your settings to you surroundings. I always tweak my settings especially on my drive pedals, what worked yesterday in the rehearsal room might not work today on stage. That's why even with a new pedal, if it sounds good at home, at practice and on stage, then only is it a keeper.

warrenpridgeon

Jayhell wrote: Someone once had a theory that lead guitarists, especially the technical types unconsciously set their tone up in a specific manner so they can hear the technical detail of what they are doing not necessarily to be pleasing to anyone's ears. They then think that this is good because they can hear what they are doing. It's a theory but it makes sense. Now add that to a lead guitarist's ego and plain stubbornness and you have problems. 'Dude, too much lows and you are to loud!', 'But I always play these settings!' Exactly, that's the problem, adjust your settings to you surroundings. I always tweak my settings especially on my drive pedals, what worked yesterday in the rehearsal room might not work today on stage. That's why even with a new pedal, if it sounds good at home, at practice and on stage, then only is it a keeper.

When we only had one church campus we would play a set in the morning and again in the evening... I would leave everything set up for the day and would sometimes have to change my settings for the evening set because the different temperatures made stuff sound different... Here in the vaal the temps vary a between morning and evening.

It's funny how you get different "kinds" of music... Music for people who wanna just listen to something cool and then there is music for guitarists... lol...

Joke:
Q: How many lead guitarists does it take to screw in a light bulb?
A: One, he just holds it up while the world revolves around him. hehehehe....

LooneyAtTheGate

Yes definitely turn down the gain.

Another thing is to have a decent sized cab, at least a half-stack. Turning up a 10" or 12" doesn't move enough air to sound decent in a band practice mix, when competing with acoustic metal drums. As a teen I did not realise that and wondered why I sounded terrible!

Malkav

I always low cut pretty aggressively up to 160 or so cause 7 & 8 string guitars very happily cross over into the bassists range if you aren't careful ?

I think the most important thing I realised playing live is that those nice sparkly top end frequencies may sound great at home, even in band practice, but when you're pushing over 120dbs they sound like an ice pick skull f***ing you. ?

Mixerboy

The other problem with "lead guitar" sound is it's usually set up with max distortion + delay + reverb to hide all the mistakes, that combined with the neck pickup = sloppy shred heaven

warrenpridgeon

Mixerboy wrote: The other problem with "lead guitar" sound is it's usually set up with max distortion + delay + reverb to hide all the mistakes, that combined with the neck pickup = sloppy shred heaven

Lol...

I had EMG81 and an EMG85 in my Epi Les paul... When my guitar broke I lent a guitar, with "cleaner" pickups, from a buddy for a while... WOW...I noticed how lazy I played certain songs and riffs... This forced me to improve dramatically.

Later I got my PRS SE 24, which has (IMO) much better pickups than the standard epi pickups, it also highlighted the individual mistakes I was making... Again forcing me to improve...

So that "sloppy shred heaven" tone makes you lazy... lol

guidothepimmp

Pff..

EVERYBODY knows.. want a proper metal tone, just get a metalzone man 8)

Jayhell

guidothepimmp wrote: Pff..

EVERYBODY knows.. want a proper metal tone, just get a metalzone man 8)

Is this sarcasm? ?

warrenpridgeon

Jayhell wrote:
guidothepimmp wrote: Pff..

EVERYBODY knows.. want a proper metal tone, just get a metalzone man 8)
Is this sarcasm? ?

I believe/hope so... lol

Jayhell

warrenpridgeon wrote:
Jayhell wrote:
guidothepimmp wrote: Pff..

EVERYBODY knows.. want a proper metal tone, just get a metalzone man 8)
Is this sarcasm? ?
I believe/hope so... lol

If not, different strokes, hey. There must be a reason why they sell millions of those.

warrenpridgeon

Jayhell wrote:
warrenpridgeon wrote:
Jayhell wrote:
guidothepimmp wrote: Pff..

EVERYBODY knows.. want a proper metal tone, just get a metalzone man 8)
Is this sarcasm? ?
I believe/hope so... lol
If not, different strokes, hey. There must be a reason why they sell millions of those.

They are definitely usable...

G-Man

I modded my metal zone with the Monte Allums kit, I think it sounds great but what do I know.

arjunmenon

I think this applies to most music, not just metal.
Bedroom tone is just that....bedroom tone.

Players who've played their live settings in isolation understand why it won't sound awesome at home, but sounds killer come gig-time.

The below pic has been very helpful for me in understanding where most instruments reside in the spectrum. This then gives me a ballpark idea on where i need to be.

EDIT - I've played a Monte Allum modded MZ too. They're pretty decent.

Psean

Arjun Menon wrote: I think this applies to most music, not just metal.
Bedroom tone is just that....bedroom tone.

Players who've played their live settings in isolation understand why it won't sound awesome at home, but sounds killer come gig-time.

The below pic has been very helpful for me in understanding where most instruments reside in the spectrum. This then gives me a ballpark idea on where i need to be.

Thanks!

Mixerboy

From the same guy:

warrenpridgeon

Mixerboy wrote: From the same guy:

I wouldn't say the metalzone is sh**...
I did like some of the tones he got out of all the pedals.

Mixerboy

I remember seeing a video where a guy got a pretty good sound out of it but that was using it just for the distortion into a cabinet impulse, so he was using it like a regular amp sim which kind of defeats the the whole thing.