Help me spend about R50k for band gear

aja

So I have an awesome boss, who likes music. The other day a few of us had a "band" meeting at lunch time and our boss overheard us talking. Then he said why don't we have a proper company band? He will give us rehearsal space in this huge (really huge) studio in our new office building and he will buy us gear! ?arty:

Now we have a Wharfdale PA and a 32 channel mixer (or something like that) and some mics already. We need an electric drumkit, keyboard, bass amp and guitar amp as well as two monitor speakers. We supply our own instruments and effects pedals if required.

We got an initial quote of nearly R50k and he seems happy with it, but we arent quite sure what to get and this isnt exactly gonna happen for certain, but let's see what happens.

So we will spend about R15k on a keyboard, R15k on drumkit, and the rest on monitors and amps. We also need a DI box for acoustic guitar. The keyboard needs to be a good one with full midi and weighted keys etc.

We will just get two mid range wharfdale monitors.
For bass amp we are looking at the fender rumble 150 -- does that seem like a good choice?
For guitar amp we can't decide. Tube or solid state or modeling multi effects into the desk? We can spend R5-10k on the guitar amp. Music connection advised we get a blackstar ID30. If we go tube, then what would you recommend? I don't like the idea of micing it up, seems like effort. So should we just get a multi effects and go into the desk? Seems the simplest option, and different people can save their presets. Or maybe a Roland cube? The nice thing there is the guitar amp becomes a monitor speaker for the guitarist and the cubes seem to take any input really well, like electric violin. The other guitarists hate the idea of multi effects but they don't have an answer when I ask them about micing up the amp and keeping levels correct.
We got quoted on a samson DI box. Are they any good?
I have the model numbers of the roland drums and yamaha keys at work, so I will get them tomorrow.

The people in the company play everything from trumpet to violin and many people play guitar. The idea is that we get to jam at the office and occasionally perform for people for fun. We want to be able to practice quietly as well as perform using the same gear. Style of music ranges from country to jazz to rock. No really heavy stuff, Muse is about as heavy as it would get.

A subsidiary company of ours is a film production house that does music videos as well. So we can record and edit too. We have an abundance of macbook pro's on the way so any gear that interfaces well with mac will be beneficial since the boss is an apple fan.

How does a drummer typically hear the band? Do they have headphones that run all the way to the desk?

Thanks for the advice!

P.S. yes, I am aware that he is a good business man and is using the band gear as incentive for us to stay at work longer, but honestly, we don't mind hehe

giggsy

No. Just no. Not fair.

And I checked twice, its not April 1

Chocklit_Thunda

I feel the same way..... >☹ how is this even a thing :'(

BobC

Hey Aja

Thought about one of these?

http://www.jamhub.com/

Enjoy the spending spree.

Cheers

doc-phil

That is awesome. And I'm going to assume you work at an ad agency or something... for us, every minute of time not spent working is a waste of 0.1 of an hour of billable time.

aja wrote: Muse is about as heavy as it would get.

Sheesh, I didn't think Muse would ever fit on any sort of scale of heaviness... ?

AlanRatcliffe

Exactly what PA do you have? No use planning to DI electric guitars and especially electric drums if the amp isn't up to the job (kick drum alone can soak up a lot of your available headroom on a smaller PA). With a smaller PA, usually you are best served by an acoustic kit and use the PA for voices and acoustic guitars and adding reinforcement to your other instruments (to lift them out of the mix for solos, etc.). Acoustic kits also take a lot more punishment in "shared" environments where a lot of people might be fooling with them. Electric kits shine where the need to keep volume down outstrips all other requirements or if you want to record/amplify very simply without all the hassles of mics.

For guitar amp, Yeah, probably a Cube 60 or a Fender Mustang III, something like that - a variety of tones that work at a variety of volume levels, simple to use, big enough to do most of the heavy lifting, low maintenance and easily DI'd instead of having to mic up. Don't go multiFX - a lot of players (especially casual ones) don't have any inclination (or any idea) to program them properly. If you must go DI, get a Sansamp or two - something as simple to use as the real thing.

Get a DI box or two. I don't know the Samsons well, but have used them before with acceptable results (feature-wise and sonically on a par with my Boss DI, which has been serving me well for nearly two decades). Still, given the choice, I'd budget higher and get a Baggs PADI or two, which has the added EQ and works really well on any instrument with a pickup and has an anti-feedback notch filter that works pretty well (if you know how to use it).

BTW, does your desk have phantom power? That'll save you a lot of battery hassles for DI boxes (and make sure any DI you buy can run on phantom).

Bass amp, I'm not too au fait with exactly what is available ATM. But look at models at least 150W and up. Once again, let the amp do the bulk of the work and just use the PA to add a little oomph when needed as well as to get better coverage/spread of the higher frequencies.

Keys I have a preference for the Roland Stage Pianos like the RD series. Avoid home keyboards like the plague - they break too easily.

Monitors, get 10" or 12" unless you have electric drums, then you'll want at least 12". Get three - at least two active and one passive slave. Use the one active and the slave for the folks at the front and the other active for the bassist and drummer (and if it's an electric kit, they'll really want a 15"). If you can, and your desk has three separate monitor aux sends, get three actives.

Don't forget to budget for whatever cables you will need either. Best thing is to buy a roll of instrument cable, a roll of mic and a bunch of plugs - works out far, far cheaper and more durable in the long run.

aja wrote: The people in the company play everything from trumpet to violin and many people play guitar.

Yo won't have to do much if anything for brass - them b-gers is loud already. Violins, etc. will be covered by your DI's, providing they have pickups already. If you expect to get many acoustic instruments which have no pickups, add a contact pickup like a Schaller Oyster to your list (and a roll of carpet tape), so you can just stick it on to whatever needs it. Not ideal, but better than nothing.

How does a drummer typically hear the band? Do they have headphones that run all the way to the desk?

See monitors above. The advantage of using a monitor over phones is the Bassist (or whoever else is in the backline) shares it. If the drummer does use headphones, then run a line level aux send to their position and give them a headphone amp, so that while the engineer mixes his monitor mix, the drummer has control over the volume.

Psean

No way! ? That's so cool ?

For a bass amp, check out the Ibanez Promethean range. The 300W 15" combo in particular is a good deal at the moment. Also has an XLR out so no need to mic' it up.

AlanRatcliffe

Psean wrote: For a bass amp, check out the Ibanez Promethean range. The 300W 15" combo in particular is a good deal at the moment. Also has an XLR out so no need to mic' it up.

Lovely little amps. Poor Man's Mark Bass ?

Greg

For keys, check out the Korg Stage Vintage 1 or the Nord keyboards.

Those are KILLER keyboards. If I could, I'd have a Stage Vintage....

aja

BobC wrote: Hey Aja

Thought about one of these?

http://www.jamhub.com/

Awesome suggestion, will definitely check it out! Thanks

doc-phil wrote: That is awesome. And I'm going to assume you work at an ad agency or something... for us, every minute of time not spent working is a waste of 0.1 of an hour of billable time.

aja wrote: Muse is about as heavy as it would get.
Sheesh, I didn't think Muse would ever fit on any sort of scale of heaviness... ?

Enjoy the spending spree.

Cheers

I work for an Engineering consulting firm that does student training and postgraduate research.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: Exactly what PA do you have? No use planning to DI electric guitars and especially electric drums if the amp isn't up to the job (kick drum alone can soak up a lot of your available headroom on a smaller PA). With a smaller PA, usually you are best served by an acoustic kit and use the PA for voices and acoustic guitars and adding reinforcement to your other instruments (to lift them out of the mix for solos, etc.). Acoustic kits also take a lot more punishment in "shared" environments where a lot of people might be fooling with them. Electric kits shine where the need to keep volume down outstrips all other requirements or if you want to record/amplify very simply without all the hassles of mics.

We have two Wharfedale 15D's, as shown here -- are they any good?:
http://www.wharfedalepro.com/Home/Products/POWEREDLOUDSPEAKERS/TITANACTIVE/TITAND/Titan15D/tabid/441/Default.aspx

We definitely need to be able to keep volume down, acoustic kits are a no go unfortunately.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:For guitar amp, Yeah, probably a Cube 60 or a Fender Mustang III, something like that - a variety of tones that work at a variety of volume levels, simple to use, big enough to do most of the heavy lifting, low maintenance and easily DI'd instead of having to mic up. Don't go multiFX - a lot of players (especially casual ones) don't have any inclination (or any idea) to program them properly. If you must go DI, get a Sansamp or two - something as simple to use as the real thing.

Good point. We will look at the Mustang III.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:Get a DI box or two. I don't know the Samsons well, but have used them before with acceptable results (feature-wise and sonically on a par with my Boss DI, which has been serving me well for nearly two decades). Still, given the choice, I'd budget higher and get a Baggs PADI or two, which has the added EQ and works really well on any instrument with a pickup and has an anti-feedback notch filter that works pretty well (if you know how to use it).

The notch filter could come in handy. I will have a look at that.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:BTW, does your desk have phantom power? That'll save you a lot of battery hassles for DI boxes (and make sure any DI you buy can run on phantom).

I have no idea! Something to check out.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:Bass amp, I'm not too au fait with exactly what is available ATM. But look at models at least 150W and up. Once again, let the amp do the bulk of the work and just use the PA to add a little oomph when needed as well as to get better coverage/spread of the higher frequencies.

That makes perfect sense.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:Keys I have a preference for the Roland Stage Pianos like the RD series. Avoid home keyboards like the plague - they break too easily.

Ok thanks.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:Monitors, get 10" or 12" unless you have electric drums, then you'll want at least 12". Get three - at least two active and one passive slave. Use the one active and the slave for the folks at the front and the other active for the bassist and drummer (and if it's an electric kit, they'll really want a 15"). If you can, and your desk has three separate monitor aux sends, get three actives.

Thank you, I will do that.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:Don't forget to budget for whatever cables you will need either. Best thing is to buy a roll of instrument cable, a roll of mic and a bunch of plugs - works out far, far cheaper and more durable in the long run.

What? We need cables? Oh yeah totally forgot about that haha. Well not totally, we have some cables but we need more.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:
aja wrote: The people in the company play everything from trumpet to violin and many people play guitar.
Yo won't have to do much if anything for brass - them b-gers is loud already. Violins, etc. will be covered by your DI's, providing they have pickups already. If you expect to get many acoustic instruments which have no pickups, add a contact pickup like a Schaller Oyster to your list (and a roll of carpet tape), so you can just stick it on to whatever needs it. Not ideal, but better than nothing.

Good idea. We were just talking about classical guitars without pickups.

How does a drummer typically hear the band? Do they have headphones that run all the way to the desk?

Psean wrote: No way! ? That's so cool ?

For a bass amp, check out the Ibanez Promethean range. The 300W 15" combo in particular is a good deal at the moment. Also has an XLR out so no need to mic' it up.

I will do that! Thanks man!

Greg wrote: For keys, check out the Korg Stage Vintage 1 or the Nord keyboards.

Those are KILLER keyboards. If I could, I'd have a Stage Vintage....

I will look at them, thanks. I don't know much about keys ?

AlanRatcliffe

aja wrote: We have two Wharfedale 15D's, as shown here -- are they any good?:

They should do nicely. I don't know the new ones, but generally the Titans are amazing for the money. The last gen 15" versions had a pretty decent low end kick, but I wasn't wild about the mids - they made electric guitars and vocals vanish a bit. Hopefully they have improved on that with the new models. Certainly enough low end extension and power to handle the drums.