Greg
Yo!
So, I have no money but I'm doing some dreaming/planning for an amp and thought I'd ask a few questions about these sorts of things here!
So I know Alan has a BF Twin, which looks/(probably)sounds EPIC! So I'd love to hear what he has to say about all this, but here it is:
I've read a bit aboutm and understand the difference between, Blackface, Silverface, Pretend Blackface and Reissue as well as Super, Twin and Deluxe Reverbs.
I've come to the following conclusions:
I know the Twin is a fantastic amp, most decent festivals have a Twin available but it's far too heavy and loud for regular gigging use so I think that's out of the question. (SR = 29.48kg and Twin = 34kg)
I would love to get hold of a decently priced BF Super Reverb(SR) or a RI SR or RI Deluxe Reverb(DR). The BF DR is a serious collectors items and prices seem to range from $2000-$5000 (way out of my price range).
I know the Super Reverb is a tad heavier than my DeVille (22.7 kg) but I could handle another 6-7kgs for a Blackface SR!
I want a quality, reliable guitar amplifier that will treat me well in rehearsals and club gigs and that I can really abuse and rely on.
Questions:
Does anyone have experience with BF and Reissues of this type?
How does the DR manage live? How much clean headroom does it have?
How is the SR live? Does it earbleed before it breaks up?
Does anyone have tips for buying internationally or online?
What power conversion issues are there for amps from the US and UK?
What sort of price would be recommendable for a BF SR, RI SR and RI DR?
Buying brand new from a store seems a bit silly and I generally judge if something is overpriced by seeing how it compares to "www.wantitall.co.za", which is incredibly overpriced itself. The only amp of these sorts I have access to is the RI SR at Bothner's in Claremont but one can't really know how an amp behaves (at least not me) unless it's in a proper live situation. This SR is marked at R30,000... which is why I'm considering buying online and/or overseas.
P.S.
Apologies for a rubbish thread, trying to get it in before bed! Off to Rocking the Daisies tomorrow!
epictring
Greg wrote:
Questions:
1. Does anyone have tips for buying internationally or online?
2. What power conversion issues are there for amps from the US and UK?
1. Only buy online if you're certain you're going to save enough money to justify not having as good a warranty as buying locally. Not to mention the (extremely) rare cases of damage etc. Buying amps online is generally expensive though because of the high shipping fees. Make sure you are aware of all additional costs such as import duties (calculate here:
http://www.dutycalculator.com/new-import-duty-and-tax-calculation/ ). It is also always better to play an amp before buying since quality even differs unit to unit in big brands such as Fender. Make sure you know everything you've been wondering about on the amp and ask the seller any questions
before ordering. That being said, I've purchased a Vox VT100 from eBay (30kg) and it arrived in less than a week in perfect condition, I also saved money on that particular deal, but this can vary greatly from amp to amp.
2. Amps from the UK will work perfectly here, amps from the US will need an (quite expensive) power converter, which makes it not worth it sometimes to purchase from the US. You can also replace the power supply unit from US amps for just under R1000.
DO NOT PLUG AN AMP FROM THE US INTO SA POWER (without modification).
If I were you I'd look at the used market. Tube amps are made to last, and I will probably never again buy a amp new again (unless I'm overflowing with money, but who is?). It's irresistible looking at the great deals there are to be had on Gumtree and other places, especially on those amps - if you go this route, play it very safe, as there are scammers out there as well (but worth it, if you play safe).
Good luck!
AlanRatcliffe
Quick reply - I'll respond in full when I have a bit more time.
Reissue Supers aren't the same as the old BF Supers. More gain, less character. Prices are crazy ATM thanks to SRV. Very, very rare on the s/h market.
Transport costs mostly negate any savings when it comes to buying something as big and heavy as an amp overseas.
Twins pop up fairly frequently and at really good prices (between R8K and R12K) - mostly early silvers (also awesome amps and can easily be blackfaced if you want), a few of the high power Twins (near impossible to BF and quite a different animal) and occasionally BF. Something to bear in mind is you can pull two valves and a speaker and drop the power to 40W as well as bring the weight down. You can also fiddle with biasing and valves to get them to break up a bit at lower volumes (mine starts at 3). They start sounding good at 2.5 anyway and take pedals really well...
Deluxe is the perfect small club amp and mikes up well for the bigger stages. Not as good with pedals as the TR or SR though. The RI model is great although some like to change the speaker for something with a tighter low end at higher volumes.
Tokai-SA
I would choose the Hot Rod Deluxe.
singemonkey
If you want a super reverb, your cheapest option for the genuine sound might be to build a kit - because, as Alan says, originals are in massive demand. People who have them, keep them. The Reverend Horton Heat is another one who swears by his supers.
Reinhard
The reissue amps will sound nothing like the originals, as others have said. I'll give my impressions on the ones I have.
SF DR: Sounds great, light and easy to transport. Not much clean headroom. If you gig it you will need to mic it. I have seen if you tilt it back it projects a bit better. In a full band situation your monitor better be working if you want to hear what you are playing.
The problem is these are near impossible to find locally. You never see a classified for them and the guys who have them don't want to sell them.
BF SR: A quad of 10's sound glorious. More headroom than the DR, but also just gets loud to a certain point and then just gets dirtier. I have cranked one with an ES-330 and it sounded fantastic. The cleans are your typical sparkly Fender cleans. It is big and heavy and a pain to transport.
Should you get a vintage amp, keep in mind it may need a little or a lot of TLC. I had to replace 3 of the 4 speakers in my super reverb. That's is expensive, but nowhere close to what modern Fender amps cost locally. If you want a DR, a kit will cost you around $1000, add shipping and VAT etc. If you can wire it yourself, you will save a fortune. Hell you could even buy a kit and pay someone to build it for you locally and save a lot of money.
Greg
Hmm, maybe a Twin is what I need. I was also considering getting Ben Craig to make me a amp. It'd probably cost just as much but obviously has it's pros with him being local!
Thanks for the advice this far, would like to hear more of what Alan has to say too.
BluJu
I have owned 3 fender reverb amps, A super Twin reverb, a hot rod deluxe and a blues JR.
Super Twin Reverb: Pretty similar to a regular twin, way too heavy, powerful but really nice sounding. I don't miss it at all.
Hot Rod Deluxe: Lovely amp, can do it all. A bit darker sounding that than the twin. It is like a twin with a blanket over it. Lovely amp
but more power and therefore weight than you need. It also has to be very loud to hit the sweet spot.
Blues Jnr: This amp is the winner for me. Cheaper and lighter with the perfect amount of power. Takes pedals great. It hits the sweet spot at about 3 which is more than loud enough for any gig or band prac. Super practical and great sounding amp. It has plenty clean head room.
The only thing that I would consider dropping it for is a deluxe reverb but wouldn't justify the price difference.
AlanRatcliffe
Quick Q Greg...
Are you playing with a brass section? If so, you're going to need more power than most. Esp. for clean headroom.
For me it's a case of only a Twin will do. Once I played one, there was no going back...
BluJu
Alan Ratcliffe wrote:
Quick Q Greg...
Are you playing with a brass section? If so, you're going to need more power than most. Esp. for clean headroom.
For me it's a case of only a Twin will do. Once I played one, there was no going back...
+1. Can't get much better than a twin reverb for the perfect clean headroom and pretty tone.
singemonkey
Downside of a twin reverb for me is the extreme weight and the complete inability to get natural amp drive because you'll be hounded off the stage long before you get it that loud. It doesn't just have clean headroom. It's effectively all clean headroom.
AlanRatcliffe
Why are all you young 'uns complaining about weight? When I were a lad we didn't think anything about getting up early and carrying Marshall stacks, Hammonds, Rhodes pianos and Leslie speakers all day long. </python> ? Seriously though, a Twin ain't that bad.
Find the right pedal for your tastes and drive isn't an issue. Twins love Screamers or, if you have a taste for the rough stuff, Rats too. My search ended with the Lovepedal OD11, which compliments the Twin's tone for a very natural, dynamic Fender amp kind of drive. At any volume.
Nicholas-L
I played through a twin a few years ago and someone gave me a metal zone to use (not my fave as I struggled to get what I wanted out of ut), the multi fx I was using broke so oh well was stuck with this. Plugged into that twin and oh my goodness what tone is this I'm getting (**,) I know this not... It can't be possible. If I had a PSU, a patch cable and the Super OD I had before that it could've been magic.
Greg
Curses... Well, yes to the brass and I just played a Twin yesterday at Daisies and it was on the money (even if it wasn't a delicious blackface one).
It's 10kgs heavier than my DeVille... and that's heavy! Perhaps I'll have to live with it.
JeremyE
I agree with Alan on the twin...It may be heavy but for that tone its worth it. Plus if it doesn't have wheels on you can always pop some wheels on it to make life a little easier. The twin is still my ultimate fender.
Greg
Well, presently I'm using 4 pedals the most: EHX English Muff'n -> ZVex SHO -> Strymon Brigadier Delay -> Strymon Bluesky Reverb. I don't use my Fuzz's in my current two bands at all.
I use the EM with a low drive setting and I use the EQ to control the tone of the Fuzz pedals I have BEFORE it. (Toolshed, Jimi Octave Fuzz, LBMuff w/ Tone Wicker)
The EM provides some really nice tone-shapping for the fuzz. I know the Octave fuzz is a unruly beast and doesn't always behave properly and the EM makes it really meaty and expressive.
The SHO is my "clean" boost after the EM.
I've been running this set up through my DeVille at home gigs and rehearsals and Twins at festivals and I'm finding it to be pretty reliable and adaptable. The Twin coupled with my 6120 is a pretty perfect combo without any pedals and Twin's are known for how nicely they take pedals.
Well... I'll keep my eyes peeled for a Twin and if anyone sees one, please drop me a PM! I'm gonna do some research and also speak to Ben Craig about what he'd do in the same vain as a Twin.
AlanRatcliffe
epictring wrote:
Don't have time to read the thread but saw this one earlier today (apologies if your not talking about this
Neither a Super or a Twin, the Super Twin is an absolute monster with 180W of ear-destroying valve power. I'd hang on for an early silverface or a blackface to pop up.
Greg
Alan Ratcliffe wrote:
epictring wrote:
Don't have time to read the thread but saw this one earlier today (apologies if your not talking about this
Neither a Super or a Twin, the Super Twin is an absolute monster with 180W of ear-destroying valve power. I'd hang on for an early silverface or a blackface to pop up.
Definitely waiting for the right Blackface to pop up. If I can nab an early Silverface with the blackface circuit, then that'll be fine! Cosmetically, the Blackface does it for me more.
matta
If you need clean headroom then the Twin is the way to go, though personally I've gone DOWN in size.
I rarely gig and prefer the amp's distortion than a drive box in front of it. Like Brendon I've switched to a Blues Jnr, which I've heavily modified. The tone stack now has a 'Blackface' option as well as negative feedback acting as 'Presence' control and revamped Master section. I've been so happy with it I've sold my Blackface Bandmaster and AC30's, I just have the 5W 57' Tweed Champ and the 15W Blues Jnr now.
Interestingly I sat in on a session with a big name engineer and band in England at Real World Studios and I'm constantly hearing how 'HUGE' the guitars sound... no amp was bigger than 15W and most were between 2-5W, all tube.
I understand that in your situation needing the headroom when gigging live the TR makes sense, but for many on the Forum it is overkill and in order to get your amp to break-up you'll need to either dump a load of the power or get a smaller amp.
Cheers
Matt
