Retail price with discount or lower sticker price?

Mr-M · 2011-06-29T15:25:39+00:00

There's been a lot of heated debate lately about SA prices for guitar gear. One of the things that kept coming up (aside from the obvious), is that a store's sticker price on the guitar/ amp/ pedal is always a non-discounted price. In other words you usually have to ask for your discounted price before you know what you'll pay. Some frustration was expressed at not being able to see up front what the price is just by looking at the price tag and some questions were raised as to why it is that way. The answer is simply because that's how it has always been. It's not like you can say to the guy in Incredible Connection that you saw the same laptop at Matrix for less and unless he beats the price, you walk. For non-guitar products, we usually find the product we want in the price range we're shopping in and pay the price without haggling. Strangely music shops still operate like 3rd world open air produce markets. The question to you, the average guitar player is this: would you prefer to see the lowest price advertised on the item up front? In other words, a similar system to the USA, where there is a Retail and Street Price - which is what you pay. I'm genuinely interested what guitarists out there think about this. Perhaps I can use your feedback to help change the industry for the better? Or do you prefer the current way of things - getting a good deal because the store gives you a discount? Many customers do genuinely prefer this, so if you're one of those, speak up. This is NOT ABOUT SA PRICES BEING TOO HIGH Therefore, no discussion on that please. It's been extensively covered elsewhere. Your opinions please?

chris77

Ja, but now see I'm a scaly bastard so after a while i see what you're up to and say 125, knowing you will say 75 and I can sell it to you for the 100 I wanted in the first place. You think you won the round, but you didn't. And the even bigger loser is the poor sod who paid 125. Ha, what a schmuck....

deefstes

exsanguinator wroteThe RRP is avaliable to the public for every product sold in RSA,just phone the suppliers/importers/wholesalers etc...

See this is the thing that annoys me. That's what physical outlets are for, so that I can go there, see what is available and what their prices are. Why should I have to phone all of the suppliers for all of the products that I might be interested in before I go to a store. Why can't the friggin' store just put a price tag on the product?

chris77 wrote Ja, but now see I'm a scaly bastard so after a while i see what you're up to and say 125, knowing you will say 75 and I can sell it to you for the 100 I wanted in the first place. You think you won the round, but you didn't. And the even bigger loser is the poor sod who paid 125. Ha, what a schmuck....

Very well said!

Jacquesg4j

chris77 wrote Ja, but now see I'm a scaly bastard so after a while i see what you're up to and say 125, knowing you will say 75 and I can sell it to you for the 100 I wanted in the first place. You think you won the round, but you didn't. And the even bigger loser is the poor sod who paid 125. Ha, what a schmuck....

Shame for shmucks! The worlds eats shmucks!

Now I will shut up and see where this goes to!

exsanguinator

In most cases the price advetised on the actual item is the RRP....the cheaper prices are discounted prices

A good example is Game,Dion Wired etc...their prices are all discounted....
eg: an 1gb SD card sells for R99 at Game,should be very close at Dions...but at Yusufs camera and cell phones down the corridor costs R169...which is the original RRP the supplier nominates.
Game and Dions sell 1000 units a week for their profit...poor Jusuf only sells 3 or 4 a week if lucky
Both fair and square

I think its safe to say that most music shops advertise the RRP as the highest price....the reason in all the price differences is discounting to get customers in,sales,clearances old stocks etc etc...business is business as usual...
Its the prices above the RRP that we should be discussing...naming and shaming the stores that do it etc etc

Tokai-SA

ZarK wrote The inflated sticker prices of music shops is a farce. It serves peeps with experience who are willing/able to negotiate and leaves the inexperienced unashamedly ripped off. It’s a disgraceful marketing practice imo.

It's not inflated, it's just plain old retail, the same retail you see in every other store in the Mall.

So in fact, it's not a farce, no ones getting ripped off, and it's not disgraceful marketing.

Tokai-SA

Norman86 wrote And regards summer sales, winter sales and the like...
If they are offering a 30% discount on the price, it still looks like its the "normal" or should i say actual retail price!
because if i buy when its NOT a sale, im getting 30% off the sticker price already!

So i should, when its a sale, be getting 60% off the sticker price shouldnt i?! because its a 30% off normal price sale!

The sticker has RETAIL written on it, just like every other store you visit, and the retail is calculated the exact same way Woolworths/Game/Dion/Incredible Connection, etc, etc, calculate RETAIL in their stores.

However, guitarist/musicians want discount, so the discounted price is also written on the sticker, let's say less 25%...so you can see retail and you can see the discounted price on the same sticker.

When the store has a summer/winter sale, then they increase the discount from the already discounted price, so the original 25% discount now turns into 35/40/50%, depending on the item.

I don't see the problem?

vic

Tokai SA wrote
Norman86 wrote And regards summer sales, winter sales and the like...
If they are offering a 30% discount on the price, it still looks like its the "normal" or should i say actual retail price!
because if i buy when its NOT a sale, im getting 30% off the sticker price already!

So i should, when its a sale, be getting 60% off the sticker price shouldnt i?! because its a 30% off normal price sale!
The sticker has RETAIL written on it, just like every other store you visit, and the retail is calculated the exact same way Woolworths/Game/Dion/Incredible Connection, etc, etc, calculate RETAIL in their stores.

However, guitarist/musicians want discount, so the discounted price is also written on the sticker, let's say less 25%...so you can see retail and you can see the discounted price on the same sticker.When the store has a summer/winter sale, then they increase the discount from the already discounted price, so the original 25% discount now turns into 35/40/50%, depending on the item.

I don't see the problem?

I don't understand...why then have the retail price on the sticker as well ?

theantirockstar

vic wrote
I don't understand...why then have the retail price on the sticker as well ?

It's pysch 101, make the customer feel like he/she is getting a better deal, by getting a discount.

ZarK

Tokai SA wrote
ZarK wrote The inflated sticker prices of music shops is a farce. It serves peeps with experience who are willing/able to negotiate and leaves the inexperienced unashamedly ripped off. It’s a disgraceful marketing practice imo.
It's not inflated, it's just plain old retail, the same retail you see in every other store in the Mall.

So in fact, it's not a farce, no ones getting ripped off, and it's not disgraceful marketing.

Come on? If it is normal that shops can sell at 25-30% under "retail" (incl. profit) you're telling me the prices are not inflated??? Especially when we all know what gear actually costs abroad? Also you're comparing apples with oranges because I'd like to see these stores in the mall that sell there stock at 30% less than sticker price because I can definately do with miraculously saving 30% on everything I buy from the mall. There's obviously a massive difference between their retail price and a SA music shops'...

...and simply saying that no-one gets ripped off... Eish... try and tell that to poor lighty who's just realized that he forked out 25% more of his savings than he actually needed to...

I understand that the monopoly must be protected at all costs but it leaves someone like me who has been around the block a few times to say things like it's a farce and disgraceful marketing practice. -which is the truth albeit less digestible if you're on the other side of the fence -naturally...

Tokai-SA

vic wrote
Tokai SA wrote
Norman86 wrote And regards summer sales, winter sales and the like...
If they are offering a 30% discount on the price, it still looks like its the "normal" or should i say actual retail price!
because if i buy when its NOT a sale, im getting 30% off the sticker price already!

So i should, when its a sale, be getting 60% off the sticker price shouldnt i?! because its a 30% off normal price sale!
The sticker has RETAIL written on it, just like every other store you visit, and the retail is calculated the exact same way Woolworths/Game/Dion/Incredible Connection, etc, etc, calculate RETAIL in their stores.

However, guitarist/musicians want discount, so the discounted price is also written on the sticker, let's say less 25%...so you can see retail and you can see the discounted price on the same sticker.When the store has a summer/winter sale, then they increase the discount from the already discounted price, so the original 25% discount now turns into 35/40/50%, depending on the item.

I don't see the problem?
I don't understand...why then have the retail price on the sticker as well ?

Read the posts here, you're all saying you want to know the price of the piece of gear..well the retail price is the price...actually, you shouldn't be getting any discount at all.

Let's put it this way.
Dions, Makro, etc, etc, are making a 100% profit on anything you buy there, and you gladly pay the price and wouldn't even think of asking for an additional discount.
The retail price at a music store is also a plus minus 100% profit, the difference is the music store then gives you a discount ranging anywhere from 20% to 40%, depending on who you are and how good a negotiator you are.

You guys don't realise how little profit our music stores make...ask one of your buds who's worked in a music store how much they make after discount.

chris77

Tokai, you're right. I agree 100%, there shouldn't be any discount at all. The price you see should be the price you pay.

chris77

Still trying to wrap my head around your %. Retail price before discount is 100% mark-up? And your discount varies between 20% and 40%, depending on your negotiation skills??? If you negotiate that is, otherwise it's 0% and the store makes 100% ? Wow. Nobody is getting ripped of there I tell ya...

Tokai-SA

chris77 wrote Still trying to wrap my head around your %. Retail price before discount is 100% mark-up? And your discount varies between 20% and 40%, depending on your negotiation skills??? If you negotiate that is, otherwise it's 0% and the store makes 100% ? Wow. Nobody is getting ripped of there I tell ya...

Do you think the 100% is all profit...if the music store pays no rent, their staff all work for free, electricity is free, in fact everything is free, then I guess the 100% mark up is all profit. ?

I was a manufacturing jeweller for 15 years, do you want to know how much profit a retail jewellery store makes? ?

ZarK

If the local shops even attempted to sell at "retail" they might as well close their doors to save themselves the embarrassment of publicly going bankrupt... I mean, you can import everything and more for roughly half of the local "retail" prices, often including shipping and customs charges... Amazing how much higher our "retail" prices are compared to theirs... No explanation thus far has taken the smell of fish away...

chris77

If you mark it up 100% over cost, then yes. You generate 100% gross profit. From there you're just cutting up your 100% sized pie into slices of varying sizes until you're left with only a nett profit slice, whose size depends on the combined size of the other slices. Doesn't change the original size of the pie though, which in this case is 100% on whatever the cost price is of what you manage to sell. Now let's say one of your slices is called Discount. The bigger the discount slice, the smaller your nett profit slice. I'm saying do away with that. You will not make as much gp, but by cutting your pie into fewer slices the nett. slice will be as big, and maybe even bigger if you suddenly find you magically sell more because it's cheaper, than before. Mind you that might mean a few members of The Club fume and moan a bit, and threaten to take their business elsewhere. So be it. Sell the stock to the next guy with cash in his/her wallet, regardless of his/her connections and negotiating skills.

Jacquesg4j

You guys take it as a right to walk into a shop and play on 50 different accoustic guitars and have a variety to choose from. Ask someone like djpauw that is from namibia if he would like a store in his town that sell things a little more expensive but he can get his hands on stuff! You all do realise that when you go out and buy a mirror for your room... You will pay R1000 for something that cost under R100 to make... I know, we make tons of these! But nobody ever complain that it is too much of a markup!

Tokai-SA

ZarK wrote If the local shops even attempted to sell at "retail" they might as well close their doors to save themselves the embarrassment of publicly going bankrupt.

Really?...shops in shopping Malls in South Africa are surviving just fine selling at retail...only Music Stores give discounts, no one else.
Maybe you should appreciate the discount and stop smelling fish.

chris77

Dude, I live in Kimberley. I will give my left nut to be able to walk into a store and play 50 different guitars! ? That said, I'm being a massive hypocrite here, laying into the way music stores do business when I buy mostly from online vendors. But it's sad to me that stores have to nail the trusting and naive souls who don't negotiate their discount, just so they can sell the same gear for less to somebody else without losing their profit base to the extent that they can't still make a living out of it. The stores need to make a profit to stay open, as does any business. I'm just really really really not a fan of how they're generating that profit at the moment though. There are less exploitive to means to generate the same income imo.

chris77

NWJ jewelers also always have 35% off on the marked price of all their diamond rings. Right through the year, non-stop. (True, the lady that works there told me when I was shopping for an engagement ring). But it's clearly marked on the tags and advertised for anyone to see. You don't have to negotiate it or earn it through who you know or how often you go there....

Charlie4

Have not read all the comments (going to take a while) so I'm probably repeating what has been said.

It's great to be "rewarded" for my loyalty to a shop but it also puts me in a disadvantage at any other shop, if mine does not have the goods I'm looking for.
As much as I hate to admit this, business and relationships go hand-hand, hence the reason other people get better prices.
I might be wrong but the reason this issue irritates is because we KNOW the different prices locally and internationally and NO ONE likes to feel ripped off -
if you compare local prices to international and retail to discount and that leaves a sour taste. Maybe we're just a fussy breed after all. :-\

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