Is that all? ?

AC30s have always been loud for their power rating and, cranked to the point of drive, are absolute beasts. Definitely not a bedroom amp.

The AC15 is also loud for a 15W amp but not unmanageably so - it hangs with a drummer (as long as you don't want clean tones at a good volume - that's where the AC30 shines). Even at the 7W setting and with a 5751 tube in V2 to tame the gain a bit, I rarely get to crank mine at home (patiently waiting for my Tube Tamer).

So what you really need is an AC30 for cleans and an AC15 for crunch.
...and a roadie to help carry them. ?

Yeah which is why I sometimes wonder why there are SO many amps above 15w still. I can't see that 80% of the market can find use for these massive beasts.

I cranked the AC15HW before, even that made my ears bleed! In a good way tho ?

I find that I hold back when I crank the amps, So i find a play better at lower volumes, around 6 on my amp.

@Alan, dont you think these attenuator (tube tamers, dr z air brake etc) are going to take something away from the sound? I believe the sound as much as it comes from the tubes, the speaker plays a major part. A big part of great break up is the speaker AND amp break up. IMO ?

I think attenuators can only take away the sparkle that comes form a lekker speaker thats cranked. Im so 50/50 on these things...

toastyrat wrote: IT'S LOUD!!!!!!!!!!!
Seriously, everyone knows to get a good tone u have to crank it, but when u do i can't think of too many S.A. venues that can handle this beast.

It has a slider switch on the back which does help slightly on the volume front, marked Output Bias. The factory setting is Hot. Switch it to warm. It makes the amp slightly less aggressive sounding and lowers the wattage a tad. Not a huge volume difference, but some. That's what I used to do with mine. Although some guys don't like the tone as much on that setting.

BTW, try a Brian May AC30 if you can find one (limited edition and discontinued) for comparison if you think your AC30 is loud (which it undoubtedly is, but not like this). I've posted on here about it before. It will redefine your understanding of the word "Loud". I've played many stacks and have yet to find one that can touch it (barring the dual 8x10" 1400W bass rig I played once) for volume (obviously not clean). Plus I've never experienced anything else that liquidized my ear drums, turned my brain to mush and rearranged my internal organs quite so efficiently! ?

Brentcgp wrote: @Alan, dont you think these attenuator (tube tamers, dr z air brake etc) are going to take something away from the sound?

The speaker is a huge part of the tone, but surprisingly little of that tone is the speaker itself distorting from being overdriven. Most speakers are way overrated for the amp that's plugged into them: take a 4x12" cab with V30s in - that's a total RMS power handling of 240W per cab and chances are it'll never be hooked up to anything bigger than a 100W amp (if that!). Now look at the more modern speaker cabs and you'll see they have ratings of up to 400W.

Funnily enough, the exceptions are the Vox amps with Celestion Blues which, when fully cranked, put out slightly more than the speaker's handling - which is the other reason (aside from sheer volume) why people rarely run them flat out. At full crank, the speaker gets very flabby on the low end and has an annoying tendency to burn out.

I think attenuators can only take away the sparkle that comes form a lekker speaker thats cranked.

In most cases when the attenuator is soaking up a large amount of the amp's output, it's the difference the lower volume makes to your ears (those Fletcher and Munson blokes again), rather than the difference to the speaker. Most attenuators work best when soaking up to 9 - 12 db of the output (about half the power), which is enough to get the amp into a different gain range without significant tonal losses. Of course, If you want to scale your 100W Marshall with two 4x12 cabs down to bedroom level there will be a significant impact on tone - but then, what do you expect?

Makes sense. Thanks for helping clear that up...

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: ...and a roadie to help carry them. ?

Ja, thats the other thing, it's as heavy as they come. Don't expect to go mobile with this thing and have a good back at 50... The guy who delivered it almost broke something.

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: The AC15 is also loud for a 15W amp but not unmanageably so - it hangs with a drummer (as long as you don't want clean tones at a good volume - that's where the AC30 shines). Even at the 7W setting and with a 5751 tube in V2 to tame the gain a bit, I rarely get to crank mine at home (patiently waiting for my Tube Tamer).

That's why i can't understand why 5w amps aren't selling better. But then again shiny clean is like kryptonite to me and that's probably my reasoning. But u make a great point alan. If you want both with really good tone you almost need both kinds of amps...

+1 Alan

It's got a lot to do with how our ears handle the high spl vs the same sound at lower volumes. Generally, the highs roll off most significantly. The high end of a guitar amp's frequency response rolls off fairly early compared with full range amps and the comparatively large diameter speaker helps to preserve bass. Some attenuators provide a treble boost function to compensate for high frequency losses when used on applications that require a wider frequency response.

I've had one of these AC30-CC2 amps for 3 to 4 years now, although I bought the one with Wharfedale speakers rather than the Chinese-made Celestion Blues. I'll absolutely agree these amps can be frighteningly loud, and I'll agree that if you want one of these amps to achieve a full-tilt classic AC30 tone at all times you're not going to make many friends in most SA venues, and your band is sure to do the whole "yer too loud!" refrain...

I tend to go for amps for their cleans: give me an amp with a great clean sound at variable volumes for different band/practice situations, I'll happily use pedals for overdrive and distortion when required. I found the AC30-CC2 has a great sounding power amp, and works best the higher you crank the Master Volume: open those EL84s up and they'll really sing... then dial in your clean sound with the preamp channel gain controls. I blend the channels, using the normal channel with the brilliance switch off to add a bit of darkness to the top boost channel. The AC30 has plenty clean headroom for band situations.

From the time I've had the amp, gigging it pretty regularly and using it weekly at band practice, I'd be careful about the following if considering one of these amps:

- I know the thread title says the 'X' version, but for those who can't afford that one, the stock Wharfedale speakers on the cheaper version are pretty poor. Before they break in properly they're almost non-existent in the bass registers, strong and nasal in the mids and very shrill and fizzy in the tops. Once they break in things do improve but they're still not particularly good guitar amp speakers. For genuine AC30 tones you've got to go Alnico. That said, I've been meaning to upgrade the speakers in my AC30 since I got it... at the moment I'm thinking a pair of Celestion G12Hs for a more modern rock tone, and since the AC30 isn't my main amp, those blues are damned expensive.

- I'm no amp tech, but it’s well known that a lot of the stock components are poor quality, and in some cases aren't matched to vintage AC30 values. For the proper vintage vibe replace all the signal path resistors and capacitors (metal film and metal oxide resistors, and silver mica PF caps and Sozo coupling caps), and change the plate resistors for the correct value components (replace 100k with 220k as per vintage spec, apparently). Also, if, like me you tend to add gain with pedals between guitar and amp, remove the bright cap on the top boost channel. These mods made one hell of an improvement to the tone of my amp.

- The reverb isn't good, and the tremelo is pretty lame and flat. Retrofitting a correctly sized Accutronics pan improves matters somewhat I’ve heard, I’ve still got the stock pan in mine. I don’t tend to use much reverb anyway...

- This baby runs hot, and has a prodigious appetite for EL84s, occasionally enjoying a side helping of GZ34 seasoned with blackened HT fuse with its power tubes. If you're gigging with an AC30 make sure you're carrying spares, and spares for your spares (fuses, fuses, fuses).

- I'm getting too old to lug 2x12 combos around and I'm neither cool nor rich enough to have a personal roadie. I've got two 2x12 combo at the moment, and if I'm ever in the market to buy another gigging amp I'm most certainly going to go for a low-wattage head (preferably 30W) and a 2x12 cab. It’s more expensive but, with my advancing years, it makes a damned sight more sense to me...

Sorry for the long post, thought I'd throw in with my 10 cents (plus VAT).

The 100k plate resistor is fine, no need to put in anything else. Your 220k is not vintage spec and it will add a massive amount of triode distortion. Especially if you, like you suggest, are looking for cleans and add gain with pedals, this is inconsistent with the high plate load.
Imho if you want to change resistor values, look at the shared 130ohms bias resistor. It could easily go up to 150-180 without really making the amp sound any cooler; it will run less hot though, which saves the life on your power tubes. So the appetite is cured and you don't carry spares for spares.

Edit: I was wrong: V1, half of which is the first gain stage in the bright channel while the other half is the first gain stage of the normal channel, features a 220k plate resistor on both sides. ALL the other stages however go for 100k or even 22k, so do not replace your resistors all over. This 220k gives a sh!tload of gain!

Gearhead wrote: The 100k plate resistor is fine, no need to put in anything else. Your 220k is not vintage spec and it will add a massive amount of triode distortion. Especially if you, like you suggest, are looking for cleans and add gain with pedals, this is inconsistent with the high plate load.
Imho if you want to change resistor values, look at the shared 130ohms bias resistor. It could easily go up to 150-180 without really making the amp sound any cooler; it will run less hot though, which saves the life on your power tubes. So the appetite is cured and you don't carry spares for spares.

Edit: I was wrong: V1, half of which is the first gain stage in the bright channel while the other half is the first gain stage of the normal channel, features a 220k plate resistor on both sides. ALL the other stages however go for 100k or even 22k, so do not replace your resistors all over. This 220k gives a sh!tload of gain!

Like I said I'm no tech, but the mods I've referred to have been discussed at length by far greater minds than mine on another site: if you've got a CC2 schematic the plate resistors I'm referring to are R6 and R7. I have no idea if R6 and R7 have anything to do with V1, but I'm sure as hell still getting beautiful cleans out of my amp after the mods were done.

Sebber wrote: the mods I've referred to have been discussed at length by far greater minds than mine on another site

Could you post a link to the site of these great minds?

Gearhead wrote:

Sebber wrote: the mods I've referred to have been discussed at length by far greater minds than mine on another site

Could you post a link to the site of these great minds?

The site's called Plexipalace, and the VOX forum can be found using this link: http://vintageamps.com/plexiboard/viewforum.php?f=2&sid=c9fd75c4f2c24fad5077d6b7363c58ee. There's various discussions there about different mods for the CC series AC15s, 30s and 50s.

Just got my hotplate, thank goodness!

It works very well with the hotplate, you can crank it right up and it doesn't blow your head off. A must with this amp.

But i still think my lionheart sounds better for me. ?