My Mars Experience:

Charlie4

I apologise for such an unpleasant and long post, however I felt it was needed to share my experience with Karel Mars as accurately as possible. For the sake of being objective, it’s only fair to hear his side of the story as well. Every statement I make in this message is substantiated by documentary evidence.

I posted this out of respect for my fellow GF members. Due to the collective opinion of the forum, regarding Karel and his work I decided to approach him for a job. I unfortunately found the opinion to be skewed. Karel is indeed a friendly guy, and I’m sure his work is top class, however the way he handled business I keep asking myself: How the hell does this guy have the apparent reputation he has?

For me GAS is a two-edged sword: In order to gain great pleasure you have to suffer a bit to reach your objective. I see it as marrying a woman. I’m not interested in marrying twelve and divorcing eleven. I want one who I can be happy with to spend the rest of my days with. This is how I approached this:
I’m currently studying music full time at UCT so music means everything to me. An amp is also an integral part needed to do what I do. For a year I worked three part-time jobs whenever I had the chance, often in humiliating circumstances. I just shut up about it and kept on working and saving, working and saving. I carefully budgeted how I will spend my money so as to not deviate too far from my target: In this case it was about R8000-R10 000.

After finally saving up enough money for something decent, I decided to approach Karel. We spoke about what I wanted and he agreed it could be done. Here is where the heart of my anger lies in this whole situation: He created an expectation and crushed it. Nearly three months after paying him and waiting for feedback on his progress, I find out he hasn't done squat - He had not bought ANY of the specified parts we discussed in November, after paying him R3000 in advance, in December, for the parts of a Tweed Deluxe. When I approached him on the 17th of February to get my money back, he told me the amp could NOT be done. (He said the transformers were too big or something in that vein. How he would've built me an amp using HIS Chinese parts, is another question altogether). I would've been perfectly fine with that answer if he told me months sooner, then we could have ended this matter on friendly terms.

I have since been repaid on the 1st of July 2014 after an official court order had been put in motion, for services not delivered. It took me months to get my money back but it is finally settled.

This has undoubtedly been the most frustrating business transaction I have ever had to deal with. I know of a few guys who were unhappy with his service, yet they kept quiet about it. I refuse to do so. If it was possible to separate man from machine, I might have still bought one of his amps, unfortunately though, he is Mars Tube Audio. Karel takes pride in his work and I believe he may deliver top quality amps, yet his quality of service does not reflect that of a boutique amp builder.

If anyone has any questions, I will discuss it with you in private and even provide all the information of our correspondence from November – July. Hopefully we can all learn from this experience and may he take this to heart so that his business may one day flourish:

Honesty, Integrity, Quality.

giggsy

Charlie4 wrote: Honesty, Integrity, Quality.

+1
That is all you can ask for in life; if you give it, you can reasonably expect it back.

Gearhead

I think part of the skew in my opinion of Karel lies in that I realise that us guitarists in SA expect too much knowledge for too low a price. It must be impossible to run a proper business for Karel (or for other boutique amp builders around here) at the price level we are willing to pay.

warrenpridgeon

Sadly... This problem exists all over... People tell you they can do XYZ and then either don't do it or you have to chase them around... sucks!

arjunmenon

Gearhead wrote: I think part of the skew in my opinion of Karel lies in that I realise that us guitarists in SA expect too much knowledge for too low a price. It must be impossible to run a proper business for Karel (or for other boutique amp builders around here) at the price level we are willing to pay.

Finally...somebody addressed the elephant in the room.

Thank you.

warrenpridgeon

Arjun Menon wrote:
Gearhead wrote: I think part of the skew in my opinion of Karel lies in that I realise that us guitarists in SA expect too much knowledge for too low a price. It must be impossible to run a proper business for Karel (or for other boutique amp builders around here) at the price level we are willing to pay.
Finally...somebody addressed the elephant in the room.

Thank you.

Perhaps. I get what Gearhead is saying... we are all tight fisted gits... and I always try to get stuff as cheap as possible... lol... I think everyone does. But I am not going to try push someones price below what is fair (builders etc have bills to pay also)

The problem listed above is that the builder said he could do XYZ and later told the client that it is impossible. And it took a court order to get a refund.

Personally I've had less than good dealings with revered people off forums before... that's probably because they liked the other people they dealt with better...I don't know. So I am very wary when someone comes "highly recommended" from a forum (any forum).

Ray

If what the oke says is what happened then he should feel poorly done by. Someone agreed to something and then he had to had to struggle to get his money back. Money that he struggled to put together in the first place. So did the supplier with this very expensive knowledge underquote in the first place? Maybe. And maybe then his knowledge aint so hot after all. whose problem is that? If what the oke says is true then everyone here should be careful when dealing with this supplier/provider. Because he just steeked someone pretty bad. A few years ago someone on this forum ordered an acoustic guitar shaped like a banjo from a pretty respected builder and was not getting the forecast or promised delivery. Is it a general thing in the semi-informal music supply industry for this to happen? Certainly, I have had a few jobs done by another respected supplier of service and have only good things to report.

Attila

I don't subscribe to the elephant theory at all. If the world is not prepared to pay for whatever it is you make and hence cannot make a living out of it. For gods sake make something else that the world is buying. So that you can make a living

aubs1

Bokvet wrote: If what the oke says is what happened then he should feel poorly done by. Someone agreed to something and then he had to had to struggle to get his money back. Money that he struggled to put together in the first place. So did the supplier with this very expensive knowledge underquote in the first place? Maybe. And maybe then his knowledge aint so hot after all. whose problem is that? If what the oke says is true then everyone here should be careful when dealing with this supplier/provider. Because he just steeked someone pretty bad. A few years ago someone on this forum ordered an acoustic guitar shaped like a banjo from a pretty respected builder and was not getting the forecast or promised delivery. Is it a general thing in the semi-informal music supply industry for this to happen? Certainly, I have had a few jobs done by another respected supplier of service and have only good things to report.

Attila Barath wrote: I don't subscribe to the elephant theory at all. If the world is not prepared to pay for whatever it is you make and hence cannot make a living out of it. For gods sake make something else that the world is buying. So that you can make a living

+1

I had to repair a Vox amp a few months ago, the guy gave me an ESTIMATE, to which I said OK, go ahead. He called me two days later and explained what had to be done, and it would cost a bit more.....I agreed !! I got my amp back, better than ever. That's the way. Not the way the above story went. Sorry, I too don't agree with that!

IceCreamMan

Attila Barath wrote: I don't subscribe to the elephant theory at all. If the world is not prepared to pay for whatever it is you make and hence cannot make a living out of it. For gods sake make something else that the world is buying. So that you can make a living

Amen.....simple economics ....

Also not sure how price suddenly okay the situation....the price was agreed by both parties as I understand it ...no gun to the head involved....to then claim it was due to price that the serivice was bad....well dayum .....was one a child in the transaction.

We ave only heard one side here so let's keep judgement to ourselves but to justify it by saying gtarists are tight makes no sense at all

Shibbibilybob

Obviously this was not handled correctly by Mars amplifiers, but the elephant is valid.South African people do expect south african products (let us stick to musical gear in particular) to cost less than international equivalents. The local manufacturers have had to learn to live with this, either by selling to mostly foreign clients, by emigrating (as we guys like Nick Edge and Brain Lisus) or simply lowering their prices accordingly (see Ben Craig).

Obviously, once the price and terms have been agreed then he needs to stick with it and update you accordingly... but also, a hand wired valve amp for R8-10K? That is unrealistic pricing...

Attila

Charlie4

All I will say further about this matter is I gave a concise version of what happened. My affidavit tells the full story. You have indeed only heard my side of the story, therefore I encourage you to hear his side as well.

I don't believe Karel is a bad guy, his mind is strewn over a thousand places and that can be good and bad. For vintage amps (circuits) he really is an experienced guy for the job. This was supposed to be my dream amp, Tweed Deluxe 5C3, and had I had more money at my disposal I would have still supported him.

What I suspect happened was times were tough and the money I deposited came at the right time. He used it to keep afloat and my amp was sidelined. Had he told me exactly that I would have been very sympathetic to his situation. Unfortunately this is not how it played itself out.

I treated the situation with as much patience as possible despite my immense disappointment. At the end I was left feeling like the bad guy, nagging him to pay me back.

If he has the humility to accept fair criticism he and his business WILL improve. What he does is his passion and I admire him for sticking to his dream, because the reality is tough. Great Amp/Guitar builders/specialists in this country are few and far between and where I am able to I will continue to support them.

Wizard

I've done a few deals with Matt Alisson ranging from making cables to fuzzilla to repairing my valve amp and each time has been less than expected with better service than you'd ever reasonably expect. To add to the positive experience side of the balance sheet. Don't go Matt! Don't go!!

OD1

I found this post from a google search - as I thought that Karel was a good tech who would find things most couldn't.

I can confirm that your experience is not a isolated one. mine was in 2024. I'm not going to re-hash all of it here, but the fact is that in my dealings with him even if you pay hm - if you as a customer don't ask the right questions he won't offer a solution to whatever the problem is........why take a amp to be fixed if the person won't apply his knowledge to fix the issue, only when forced to answer a question supply the solution.

I don't know if cash flow is tight or whatever, but I was left feeling he wants to do as little as possible and get paid as soon as humanly possible. My main issue was that I took my amp to him to get a professional opinion to shoddy repair work done to my amp, and that was only because I was 'forced' to do so - everyone could see the repair done was bad, but to legitimize my claim a tech needed to say yes indeed the repair is bad....instead he says 'there is nothing really wrong or sub par done ito repair to my amp' and I suspect he did that either because the industry is small and doesn't want to rock the boat or he is friends with the owner of the place I took my amp to get repair work done or he just lacks a spine.

If work is sub par a tech should be willing to say as much, and if he wasn't willing to do so never have taken the money or agreed to take the amp as I was upfront about all of it. He is like a Ferrari without wheels.....kinda impressive initially but soon you realize that it's totally useless, if you have a wealth of knowledge but never apply or use/share it......what is the point (when paid and asked to fix/help).

He literally is the personification of a old nokia 3310 but on a pay as you go contract.....he won't move unless you chuck some coins in his slot...

modulator

This is a recurring issue, even on the hi-fi groups.
I had a very unpleasant dealing experience, with a kit. It seems the person is apt to accept orders, take the money for it, and then not bother to fill it in "good time". Or, be bothered with the quality.
I have also read reports by very happy customers...