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briang-telkomsa-net

First of all a tiny rant then some advice please

tiny Rant
I play occasionally at an open mic acoustic club near my place.
One of the reasons I do not always go to the weekly session is that I find the sound terrible -
Now I really do not claim to be anywhere near to expert in this area but for me
-volume balance between guitar and vox is not right with the volume on instrument too high and on vox too low
-EQ on each channel generally tends to be set as follows LOW +3, MID -3 to 4, HI +3 (the amp is a PEAVEY D8000 or it's pre-decessor so LO = 80Hz shelf, MID = 425 Hz peak, HI = 12kHz shelf according to what i could glean off the web?)
-the post channel EQ graphic equaliser with 10 slots is generally set to a shallow U shape, so again cutting the Mids and boosting the LO's and HI's

The overall effect is one of a very "boomy" sound where the vocals are not fully audible, even for chatter in between songs, and on top of that the instruments mostly drown out the vocals from a volume perspective.
It may be but I don't think that this is because of my older ears starting to lose their "top end"
Well at least I've got that off my chest

Some Advice please
1. Would I be correct with the following general suggested settings for a single guitar and vox?
-volume: guitar about half to two thirds of vox on what you hear (rather than the dials, sound pressure level I think its called) and vox at appropriate level for piece
-EQ on each channel tends to be set as follows LOW 0 to -3, MID 0 to +3 depending on clarity required, HI 0 to +3 depending on brightness required(the amp is a PEAVEY D8000 or it's pre-decessor so LO = 80Hz shelf, MID = 425 Hz peak, HI = 12kHz shelf according to what i could glean off the web?)
-the post channel EQ graphic equaliser: leave level except cut ranges where there is feedback, cut 80, level or boost 125 for body, cut 1kHz if annoying sound, boost relevant 4 to 8 kHz ranges for clarity, boost above 8kHz ranges where brightness required
I found myself at the desk and the above was more or less the setting I was using for the guy playing as well as for my set.

2. Seeing as this is not my system and there are other more "established" people assisting with the sound settings (as per my tiny rant) if you liked the people facilitating these evenings but don't want to be an idiot or embarrass yourself how would you go about trying to get a sound setting on the system that would allow everyone to hear clearly what was being played.

AlanRatcliffe

See my post from earlier here: http://www.guitarforum.co.za/general-discussion/advice-required-playing-acoustic-guitar-through-the-deskmixer/msg226288/#msg226288 - some common ground.

You can't always generalise, but the "smiley face" graphic EQ is a common sign of someone who has no idea. Unless it's a room with major problems, usually the closer everything on the EQs is set to flat, the better the engineer. Mids are where the human voice and guitars live, so knock 'em out at your peril.

The most important thing to remember is: There are no "magic" settings that work with every system, every venue and every example of an instrument type. There are a few rules you can apply in general, but generally you have to use your ears. Hell, I EQ on a song-by song basis - as needed (I also ride the faders, even with just a singer/guitarist).

The only rules I apply as fixed are these:
- Use your high pass filters on everything but kick, bass and keys to get rid of 90% of the low end mud.
- Graphic EQs are for room tuning on a system (or "ringing out" a monitor system), not for EQing a mix.
- Use decent mics and you will need a lot less EQ.
- A cut is better than a boost (need more mids? Cut highs and lows and boost the overall level).
- The closer to flat an EQ is set, the better it works. A combination of small boosts and cuts is more effective than large scale single frequency adjustments.

Get your EQ right and the levels follow naturally. But yeah, if there is a voice in the mix it almost always takes precedence. With the good acoustic players and singers, more-or-less equal level and minimal fiddling with it is required - let them control their own levels and dynamics or you'll end up fighting them at some point (Dave Ledbetter and Tina Schouw - easiest sound gig ever. Set basic levels and they do everything else with mic control and playing dynamics).

Oh another thing I do as a matter of course: Kill the reverb between songs to make spoken stuff more intelligible.

briang-telkomsa-net

Thanks for the feedback Alan - much appreciated
You have confirmed for me that I sort of know my stuff - its just more practice is required for improvement.

In the situation that I described I was not using the graphic eq solely as a "room adjuster" so some reading up to do there.
I like the "kill the reverb" between songs tip and it will be used in future.
Understood that there is no "magic" setting - the principles that you describe are the ones that I apply in a mixing situation - I also like and apply the "less is more" principle with minimal adjustments and with more cutting than boosting
I also like the "I EQ on a song-by song basis - as needed (I also ride the faders, even with just a singer/guitarist)" as even a moderately good player will use quite a lot of dynamics even in one song

Very few of us at the club are good enough or experienced enough ala Dave Ledbetter and Tina Schouw so the "keeping the desk manned (wo-manned?)" idea should also be followed

Once again thanks for the tips Alan ?