Big G wrote: So the title pretty much explains my question, but just to expand....

I absolutely love the Vox AC30 tone (at least the AC30/6 or AC30TB's), but find that the volume produced by one is just too much for my requirements, and so I considered the AC15's.... What I want to know is 'do the AC15's produce the same distinctive tone as the 30's, only at a lower volume?'

Then I guess the other question is 'do the new VOX's also have the same distinctive tone as the older 30's mentioned above?' There seems to be some confusion over the newer models, as some appear not to be considered as good as the originals, and others considered closer to the original? Any one able to clear up this confusion?

Trying to decide between potentially saving up for an AC15, or the Craig 2w? I'm looking at this as a major investment that I want to keep for many years!

I hope my question is clear enough?

Thanks in advance...
Regards
G!

why not just buy a power "sapper" thingymajig and keep the 30 if that is what u love

I had considered that option too, but I had heard that they can significantly alter the tone? Isn't part of the AC30's tone developed by its speakers being driven close to the limit?

This brings me to another question.....

The Old AC30's had the Celestion Blues fitted, but the more recent amps seem to have the Greenbacks or Silverbacks fitted. Do these speakers sound much different to the original blues?

Regards
G!

Big G wrote: I had considered that option too, but I had heard that they can significantly alter the tone? Isn't part of the AC30's tone developed by its speakers being driven close to the limit?

This brings me to another question.....

The Old AC30's had the Celestion Blues fitted, but the more recent amps seem to have the Greenbacks or Silverbacks fitted. Do these speakers sound much different to the original blues?

Regards
G!

Yeah the attenuators will eat some of the highs out of your sound too but used in moderation its not so bad.

Speaker crunch only comes with lots of volume, no way around that.

Greenbacks and Blues do not sound the same at all (besides the obvious difference in volume, Blues have >100dB efficiency, Greenbacks ~97dB). I can't answer your question re 15 versus 30.

Another option you could look at is the Craig Brit 15.

I had considered the Brit 15R, but its out of my buying power! Haven't actually heard one though.... Do they sound sufficiently Vox like?

Still, the Craig 2w sounds lurverly from what I've heard on the net (as good as you tube vids can show at least), and it sounds like the tone I'm after, but then I've got to add on the cost of a speaker.... It all adds up quickly.... I'm a volunteer worker/stay-at-home-dad/musician after all ?.... Why is life so complicated?? (talk about first world problems)

Cheers
G!

Big G.....they new AC15's and AC30's should sound very similar provided they have the same speakers. A Vox whether AC15 or -3O must have alnico speakers in there in my experience. Volume wise...the AC30 is NOT twice as loud as an AC15....
My advice would be to get an AC30 and pull two of the EL84's if too much volume is your problem. ( Let me check on this )
And yes, the older AC30's with original alnico speakers sound different (not necessarily better) than the newer ones for various (debateable) reasons.

If you invest in a good original AC30 you WILL get your money back when selling at a later stage ?

Yes, certainly Vox like. Lovely tone. These amps are getting out there. You may have some in Cape Town to listen to soon

Thanks for the replies folks....

@Vic... I realise that the AC30 isn't 'twice' as loud as the AC15, but it is louder, which is the point. I didn't know you could just yank out two of the tubes in order to reduce the volume? Surely this would result in the amp not actually working? Breaking the circuit?

@Sean... Think I have a lot to think about, and work out what I can afford? I seriously love the look of the Brit 15R and seperate cab, but as said, its beyond my means at present! As for my Orange Micro Terror, My phone hasn't stopped pinging all day long with enquiries about it! So if everything else I'm selling goes as quick, perhaps I'll have the cash? Hehe!

Regards
G!

Big G wrote: Thanks for the replies folks....

@Vic... I realise that the AC30 isn't 'twice' as loud as the AC15, but it is louder, which is the point. I didn't know you could just yank out two of the tubes in order to reduce the volume? Surely this would result in the amp not actually working? Breaking the circuit?
@Sean... Think I have a lot to think about, and work out what I can afford? I seriously love the look of the Brit 15R and seperate cab, but as said, its beyond my means at present! As for my Orange Micro Terror, My phone hasn't stopped pinging all day long with enquiries about it! So if everything else I'm selling goes as quick, perhaps I'll have the cash? Hehe!

Regards
G!

EDIT: Let me check this with a Tech...OK ?

No, don't pull valves on a cathode bias amp. The 2 left over will NOT be happy. All 4 valves on a AC30 share a common bias resistor, and that resister bias all 4 valves. That value resistor would have to be doubled for 2 to work. Unless the amp has sets of valves paired off, or individual bias resistors.

Grid bias pull away. Even 1 valve left would work.

Thanks for the reply... I thought the valve tugging was too good to be true!

Once I'm more organised, and have a better idea of what moneys I've managed to raise, I think you can expect a message from me sir?! Unless a used AC15/30 appears in the midst for a steal of a price!

Cheers
G!

Big G wrote: Thanks for the reply... I thought the valve tugging was too good to be true!
Once I'm more organised, and have a better idea of what moneys I've managed to raise, I think you can expect a message from me sir?! Unless a used AC15/30 appears in the midst for a steal of a price!

Cheers
G!

Yip....you CAN do the valve pulling PROVIDED you have a simple low-cost mod done ie. to provide a cathode resistor for each EL84 valve. But then you can use only one EL 84 also....to get down to about 5 watt. Also the tap on the tranny needs to be wired to 8 ohm...a simple operation. Speak to our Karel Mars ?

IMO if the speaker is such an important part of the AC30 sound (which it is), the power rating and efficiency of the speakers is an important point to consider. The 30's at full tilt drive the speakers pretty close to their limits (it was pointed out to me recently that AC30's often blow their Blues). I would say that the AC15 would get pretty close to the AC30 sound, but only with an appropriate speaker. I think that means 1x Blue.

Another thing to bear in mind is that there are a couple of different versions of each the AC15 and 30. AFAIK, they only vary in the pre stages. It would be pretty important to find out if the AC15 you're going to look at has a similar pre topology to the AC30 you like.

The AC15 Does have the VOX sound - it's not quite an AC30 any more than a Princeton is a Deluxe is a Twin, but it's very much in the same family, with VOX jangle, chime and complex gain tones. It's a fair bit quieter than the 30, but still a very loud amp for 15W. It's also quite a bit lighter and easier to transport than the 30 (1 X 12 v. 2 x 12). The modern VOXes are a bit more flexible than the classic models, able to get drive tones at lower volumes - once again, a little bit of a sonic trade-off though.

Vic wrote: A Vox whether AC15 or -3O must have alnico speakers in there in my experience.

+1. The Blue is a big part of the VOX character IMO. The downside is that it pushes up the price of the models that have it. The Vintage 30 is a great speaker, but not the classic VOX tone.

I've never heard the Craig 2W amp in question, but I can tell you deciding between the two boils down to a simple question: Marshall or VOX. The Brit 15 will be more like the VOX, but I'm not sure if your budget will stretch that far (then again, I don't know the exact price, I might be pleasantly surprised).

I used to use an AC15 (Heritage hand wired) for crunch/edge of drive tones and my Twin for cleans, but aside from the impractical size and weight of the whole rig, the VOX was too loud by the time it talked, even with an attenuator. So I sold the VOX and bought a pair of Weber speakers to skew the Twin a little to the VOX tonality. That's been my go-to since.

Thanks again for all the replies folks! Lets see what turns up and what 'moves on' in the next little while?!

Lots of thinking and research to do I guess.....

Cheers
G!

Big G wrote: Lots of thinking and research to do I guess.....

One thing you have to ask yourself is what is it about the AC30 tones you like? Then chase that tone in a smaller package. Try some of the VOX amps and try a few others (for instance, the Laney range has a few VOX inspired amps).

A friend of mine actually has the Laney Valveking 50w, and that too has a great tone, which I much prefer to the usual Marshall tone (at least the Marshall solid state amps)..... But its just not that distinctive 'Vox' tone.

To get back to the actual speakers... Why do most of the new amps ship with the greenback speakers, yet claim to have the original Vox tone, if they are very different sounding to the Blues?

Cheers
G!

Big G wrote: To get back to the actual speakers... Why do most of the new amps ship with the greenback speakers, yet claim to have the original Vox tone, if they are very different sounding to the Blues?

Don't get me wrong, it's still a damn good speaker - good sounding, more durable and keeps the cost down. The rest is probably marketing - the words "classic" and "vintage" sell amps, and most folk haven't actually had enough hands-on experience with the real thing to tell the difference. They still make the models with them for those that know the difference and can afford it.

For me, the Vox amps with Blues are just one of those magical combinations, like LPs with Marshall amps and Strats with Fender amps.

So there is a third option, and Mods, if this is seen as me 'punting the goods', since this is a sister company to my Bass Amp endorsers (but at present I have no affiliation with them themselves), then please feel free to remove this question......

Before I even considered the Craig 2w and AC15, and for that matter, even before the Orange Micro terror, I was looking at the DV Mark Galileo 15 head. Problem is that I don't know anyone that has actually used one, or even a price, so I don't even know if thats in the same ballpark or not? Anyone any experience with one? The other thing I like about some of the other DV Mark heads is that they have the 'wattage attenuator' built in, so you can drop right down to 0.5w if required.

Basically, I should have probably have been a bit clearer from the start, but What I guess I'm looking for is a nice mild clear crunchy distortion which you only get from tube amps. I'm not particularly looking for a full on weapon of mass distortion, although that would be cool if it can do that too, but that kind of pure tone thats just crossing the break up threshold stepping into tube distortion, if that makes sense? So far, the Vox is the closest to that sound I've come. Oh, and this is to be used with an Epi LP if that helps? Maybe later down the line a Tele will join its ranks too?

Sorry for the 'all over the place' topic, but the more I think about it, the more stuff to be considered jumps out.

Cheers
G!