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Maybe someone can help me. I'm after one of these:

http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Supplies:_Wire,_cables/Stereo_Y-cable.html?actn=100101&xst=3&xsr=81164

It's a Y-Cable. And I'll tell you why I want it. Well, maybe I want it you can tell me.

I am busy making a hellofa mess putting together a pickup for an acoustic guitar. It's a K&K lookalike. Well, it's not going to look anything like the K&K but hopefully it will give a closish result. So, I've got these piezo disks. And I've got some 24 gauge hookup wire. And I've got soldering things. And then I solder the wire to the disks and then to an output jack. You should check this fruit salad. I've got buggered up disks all over the place. Now, I've been putting it to a mono jack and that is fine becasue as I understand it that is where a passive pickup goes. Alright, so that's a bit like the K&K pure mini ne. Becasue I really think these UST's and SBT' and things are priced hectic for what they are hey. Anyway, K&K got some other models and one I like the look of is the one with a microphone and the piezo SBT things. And the addition of the microphone adds a hellofa lot to what I believe is already a hellofa lot. And I cant believe that they're using anything more than a little elxtret capsule housed in something sexy which nobody is going to see. So I wondered over to Communica and bought some electret microphones. Just littl alluminium capsule type things. And then I wondered a bit further down the road and bought a headset with a microphone on it and pulled it apart right there so I could see the gooseneck. But the gooseneck isnt so lekker so on my way back I went back to Communica and bought some stiff copper wire. Quite stiff. And the plan is to run it alongside the hookup wire from the microphone all covered in some heatshrink (which I bought as well) and then that will be my gooseneck.

I should have done this a long time ago - the new paragraph that is. The the plan is to link the wire from the piezos and the microphone to a stero output jack. Either that or slap a preamp between the microphone and the output jack which will be stereo still. I've got a fishman something or the other from a Cort that noone wanted to buy from me for next to nothing I might add. Well, either that or slap it through a preamp type thing between the output jack and the amplifier. Those are a dime a dozen as well.

Well I'm going to need some sort of special cable from the guitar now arent I? Because some signal comes from the piezos (passive) and some from the microphone which needs to head to the micophone input of my amplifier. Or have I missed the liliy?

Thanks - Ray
    I got the Baggs "Dual Source" in both my acoustics. This has a mic, but it's not on a goose neck. It's embedded in a little block of phone rubber and mounted inside the guitar but on the back, facing the top. This sort of mounting allows you to get the mic just about anywhere inside the guitar. On both of mine it's mounted pretty much under the bridge and on the bass side (round about 6th string) which is where Baggs say is usually the sweet spot BUT they tell you in the installation guide that you can move it around until it sounds good to you and then secure it in that spot.



    So there's another way of doing it, and I'm sorry I haven't even addressed what it is you are asking about.

      No, ees cool Bob. I'll tell you that I like the gooseneck thing becasue I think I can just reach in with a finger and adjust. And I dont like the 6th string story because I wonder if you wont get a sort of overpowering whooooff there. Except maybe on this Recording King I've got which seems a bit weak low and this guitar just happens to be what I am subjecting to the shananagans.

      As far as sweetspot is concerned I would think (and I am oh so most probably wrong) that it would be somewhere in front of the guitar. And that has been one of my thinkings as well. to get the microphone out front. Now, I'm not creating any state of the art piece of kit but I dont want it to look like those dental braces on the outside either. But I'm actually just thinking aloud here so please feel free to ignore.
        When I had these pickups installed the Larrivee was done first. Mark at McGibbon's spent a bit of time looking for a sweet spot but ended up pretty much where Baggs (who can be presumed to know a thing or two about such things) said it would be all along. So when the Morgan was done Mark just went for Baggs's default positioning.

        To my ear what the mic does is add some "air" to the sound. The definition comes from the UST, the mic is more about ambience and three-dimensionality.

        Baggs seem to think that between the bridge and the soundhole, or even right under the bridge as in their Anthem system, is the way to go and that there's less hassles with feedback there.

        Something else I will tell you.... some years ago I had a chat with luthier Nick Benjamin. His guitars have a variation on the cutaway called the "scoop". I asked him if this lost any tone. He said no. He said his tests had shown that the top is pretty dead in front of the sound hole - the back is still working a little, but the top is dead (hence his scoop design). People always assume that the sound of an acoustic guitar comes out of the sound hole. It doesn't. It comes from the vibrating top.

        I've got out my copy of the ever useful Acoustic Guitar Owner's Manual (978-1-890490-21-8) and they show some laser holography photos of a vibrating top. They took shots at 287, 460 and 645 hz, and only at 287 is there any action even around the sound hole, in the other two cases all the vibrations are between sound hole and the back of the guitar.

        So all this seems to go together - the action is towards the back of the guitar and if you want to position a mic to catch that action then it has to go south of the sound hole.

          The mics in dual systems are usually dynamics, partly so they don't need power the way an electret does and partly because dynamics pair well sonically with piezos. Oh... and all piezos are not created equal - the piezo disks are usually ceramic, while the "hot spots" and other piezos used for guitars are usually polymer, which are smoother sounding and more durable than ceramics.

          If your preamp takes two inputs, use that - then you don't need any special cables. Also, the piezos have a very high impedance (usually a few megohm or higher) and you need to keep wires as short as possible to prevent noise and signal loss. That's why premps are usually onboard or at the very least a belt pack.

          If you absolutely must have a stereo output, you can either use a Y cable (AKA "insert" cable) or use a stereo cable and make a breakout box (stereo jack in and two mono jacks out).
          I should have done this a long time ago - the new paragraph that is.
          Tell me about it! Your posts are usually entertaining, but they are difficult to struggle through sometimes - so much so that I think you probably lose some readers/potential advice givers along the way.
            Thanks guys. And sorry! I am very inconsiderate when I post.
              Ray wrote: And sorry! I am very inconsiderate when I post.
              No biggie. I'm just saying you'll probably get more response if you go back before you click on "post" and add a few paragraph breaks here and there.

              I'm the opposite, I often spend so much time on editing my posts that someone else has answered the question before I finally post it. I'll also work on a few posts at a time and skip back and forth between them, letting my thoughts settle and clarify on one while I'm writing the next one. There's an upside to this on my own threads - half the time I end up restructuring my posts for clarity to such a degree that I end up answering my own question and don't have to post it any more. ?

              BTW, back on topic - if you search for "insert cable" rather than "Y-cable", you will probably come up with a lot more hits. Basically they are just a stereo jack with two mono cables wired into it. If you can't find, any store that makes up cables will be able to make one up for you (or you can make one up yourself, seeing as you're obviously getting plenty practice soldering yourself).
                As has been said in previous posts, it's highly recommended to have an onboard preamp for the piezos and the electret mic. They both have high impedances and long cable runs tend to pick up 50hz hum and other nasty noise.

                A hint for soldering this kind of kit:- use a thin tip on the soldering iron, don't use a soldering gun, they fry everything in sight. Each joint should take max 3 seconds to solder. (When I did my apprenticeship they made us solder strands of copper wire together laid out on white paper WITHOUT burning the paper!) Practice makes perfect.

                I live in your neck of the woods and will be glad to help you out with stuff if needed. Just let me know, as I am out of country a lot but home for 2 week stretches with not a lot to do in the daytime. Just PM me..
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