mtmattan
Hi all,
I've been playing guitar for about 5 years, but this has been the year of effects pedals. (Oh man I love this forum!!)
What I'm still struggling to get my head around is why so many players (it seems) tend to go for just a few single-use effects pedals.
What I mean is why would someone use (for example), a Boss DS-1 Distortion rather than a Boss OD-20 Distortion/Overdrive twin pedal, that not only models the sound of the DS 1, but also 20 other Distortion effects.
To continue the Boss OD-20 example, I have put them side by side and listened to both the original and modeled sound of the DS 1 and could not hear any real difference. It was played through an American Tele and a Roland Cube amp.
I must admit that I do not have an expert ear and a seasoned guitarist would likely pick up the subtle differences. But is it really worth losing the versatility of 20 other effects pedals at your fingers just for nuanced differences? Especially considering if you ever played for an audience through a PA system, it would make little (if no) difference whatsoever, especially to non-musiciations.
I'm not advocating for the use of complete multi-effects pedals. (such as the Boss ME and GT series)
But I can't understand why in each category of effects pedals (Distortion, Delay, Modulation, etc) one wouldn't take the option with the most versatility.
For example, I own:
Boss OD-20 (24 distortion/overdrive)
Boss DD-7 (7 Types of delay)
Eventide ModFactor (10 modulation effects)
[Hopefully a Eventide TimeFactor soon =) ]
Granted my setup is geared toward flexibility, but the range of sounds it creates is phenomenal.
So was just wondering why it seems most guitarists tend towards a few really good sounds rather than 10 times as many almost-as-good-modeled sounds?
Thanks, would love to hear some thoughts. ?
nick
My opinion on pedals is that they need only have 3 knobs because it'll take me about 10 minutes to find what I like out of it and then I doubt I'll ever change it drastically. Maybe a little more tweak of the tone depending on the venue Im gigging but otherwise it all stays in the same place.
I recently got the TC Electronics Hall of Fame reverb which has more settings than your television and once again I set it to spring or plate and then set the effects level and forget about it ?
ezietsman
I agree with nick. Some people like me like to keep it simple. For the last 3 months or so i've played directly into my single channel amp, no pedals whatsoever, i just want clean, dirty and some in between which i get by fiddling with my guitar's volume. This setup doesn't work if you want many different kinds of dirt/modulation/ or styles of guitar sound. I can't be bothered to deal with 10 knobs on my amp. 2 is enough for me for what i play, and i mostly play my own noodles trying to come up with something interesting.
yesterday we went to a shop to check some new guitars and we tried the one through a cube 80. Sounded like it has a blanket over it despite my knob turning efforts. The guitar sound came through clearly when we went into a laney valve amp. It's just possible that the cube won't let you hear the differences between those pedals, or maybe it will. I agree that small nuances are really irrelevant in the bigger scheme so it boils down to what makes you happy with your setup. irt/modulation/ or styles of guitar sound. I can't be bothered to deal with 10 knobs on my amp. 2 is enough for me for what i play, and i mostly play my own noodles trying to come up with something interesting.
yesterday we went to a shop to check some new guitars and we tried the one through a cube 80. Sounded like it has a blanket over it despite my knob turning efforts. The guitar sound came through clearly when we went into a laney valve amp. It's just possible that the cube won't let you hear the differences between those pedals, or maybe it will. I agree that small nuances are really irrelevant in the bigger scheme so it boils down to what makes you happy with your setup.
MIKA-the-better-one
First off, you use Boss Ds1's and Boss OD20's as example..... that is definatly not the be all and end all of tone...... If I was stuck with a Boss pedal or a decent multi effect unit I would probably opt for a multi effect.
But Have you ever thought that all that flexabiity actually kills creativity sometimes..... I see so many guitarists who get so caught up in showing the audience 1000 different sounds in there setlist.... but never really anything quality. They get caught up in the whole variety thing.... which I think is the first place you fall short with what you propose.
Why would I want 20 semi decent overdrives if I can take my BB preamp, which is quality handmade and sounds so much better than anything a multi would give me. Why would I want to throw a gt8 infront of my Dr Z just to try push it harder with some digital sterile sounds.
If I want a Rat Distortion, I will go get a Rat, if I want a good Fuzz I will decide if I want a Germanium fuzz, a Silicon, or a Tonebender or Fuzz Face..... if I want them all... then I have some prsonal issues that I must address.
Its all about creating a sound instead of trying to emulate them all. And that is the Core of it, Multi's are fine if you want to just emulate something (if you have 100 covers to play with different tones) If you are making original music and you want your own sound then takr the time and choose carefully and get quality.
Last note you said you ran through a roland cube..... pretty much most things will sound average on a Roland Cube...... they are not very intricate or diverse in tone
Sidecar
If my sound is not what I expect, It's distracting. So I tend to get my sound as close to what I like as possible. If it's not, it ends up being something distracting rather than something I can use to really get lost in playing the music.
In the end, I guess its better to find that exact pedal you like, rather than one that does 20 different sounds that sound almost like the sound you want to hear.
mtmattan
I completely agree that musicians should be as creative as possible. Which is why I'd prefer to have a variety of sounds and effects at my disposal. Not to emulate specific sounds or to cover other songs, but rather to find your own signature sound and push tonal boundaries.
I find it quite interesting that you suggest a single stompbox may actually enhance creativity and a multi effects may actually distract you. Never thought about that ?
There's also the issue of actually having access to different effects to find what you like. I'm still a varsity student and don't quite have the financial ability to just go out and buy a stompbox because I think I like the sound. It'd be the same for anyone without enough disposable income.
I think we all wish we had a music store at our disposal but there's only so much the guys working there can handle without you buying anything - I've found out ? just imagine a weekend alone at Music Connection ? ? ?
I also find that having a multi effects actually let's you learn how, when and in what situation to use specific sounds. For example, I can model a Tube Screamer sound when I'm playing something lighter and more bluesy and can model the a Big Muff when I want some heavier fuzz. Ive learnt a lot that way and I believe it's made me a better guitarist ?
MIKA-the-better-one
I have used multi's before..... and on my side of the belief, the options are so many if often just bogs down musicians.
spent 5 years studying and in that time I managed to go through maybe about 200 pedals.... yeh 200. I am not a rich guy, I actually was not legeally cleared to work in SA but with what little money I could spare I managed to get some cool gear in and out.
I see how you may think a multi would enhance creativity by giving you endless options but as mentioned for me its learning how to utilise certain equipment to its fullest and with that understanding you really get great sounds.
For overdrives and Fuzz there is nothing like the orginal analogue sound... delays and reverbs you can get some decent stuff out of multi's......
If you are really looking for tone look at fine tuning your setup to maximise a nice foundation......
In my early days around the age of 18 -20 all I wanted was crazy sounds....
slowly I have come to just want a pure, clear, dynamic tone....... with small effects to boost that sound in certain directions thus getting new feel.
Also think about it like this..... most pro's dont use multi's they use certain effects that they have learnt to create there sound with...
Its a long road of discussion and people will say multi's are at a point where they are just the same as singles..... but for now as I always say I would prefer singles
AlanRatcliffe
I happily go both ways. :-[
I love effects and spending time sculpting sounds so they are unique and fit the music perfectly. Yes I can get caught up in it to the degree that it takes far longer to perfect a single sound than it takes some people to record a whole CD.
On the other hand, I enjoy playing and for that there is nothing to beat a couple of single purpose stomp boxes and a simple amp that just work. You can't control a playing situation the way you can in a studio - the room, audience and other players are subject to change at a moment's notice and the simpler the adjustments needed to rectify a problem the better.
Point of pride: If my pedalboard went down during a gig, I could plug in to my amp and finish the gig ...and probably still enjoy it and have fun (and it's not even a channel switching amp or one with lots of drive on tap). On the other hand, I've had my amp go down and I had my GT-8 up and running within a minute (while the rest of the band comped - I was impressed) and then we finished off the song and the rest of the evening.
Mr-M
MIKA the better one wrote:
Its all about creating a sound instead of trying to emulate them all. And that is the Core of it, Multi's are fine if you want to just emulate something (if you have 100 covers to play with different tones) If you are making original music and you want your own sound then take the time and choose carefully and get quality.
This man speaks the truth. 100% agreed. 8)
Warren
It's like the Circle of Life, only with guitar tones. ?
You start off with an amp and a guitar, straining to hold simple chords. You fall in love with layers of echo and heavily saturated distortion...you pore over mic placements and the nuances of head / cab matches etc. And, often as not, you end up going right back to guitar -> amp, or something close. ?
I think it really depends most on your current musical goal, and overall where you are as a player. In a cover band, I wanted lots of easily switchable tones so multi-fx was the way. Now that I'm just playing on my own, I'm doing lots of guitar -> amp stuff, and adding some FX post-recording. That said, I'm also still experimenting with blending different stuff using Guitar Rig as well, trying to find those soaring tones I'm looking for. Multi-fx and emulators are great for giving you lots of options to try out early on.
shaundtsl
I played mostly with multi-effects. I did go through a stage where I had single pedals, which I really loved and I still believe was my best sound. But at that stage money was really tight so I would be alot of second hand stuff and I had one or two pedals which where problematic especially where the power input was concerned and having the power cutting off during a gig was a problem and it happened too many times. Thats when I decided to go back to the multi-effects route, it just seemed a more simple easy to manage approach at the time.
If/when I am in a band again I might start looking at the single pedal route again.
kapepper
The only pedal I have ever had, and will have, and then still, i hardly use it...
I think with pedals people, indeed get to distracted from the real guitar playing, and I have to admit, when playing with a friends distortion, it does sounds "better" read: you dont hear all my errors as clearly so, in playing without effects it really challenges me to play well and correct... i can only advise this to everybody ?
I think once, I am a good guitarist, I will use pedals to shape my sound
EDIT: I realized that I always use reverb from my fender deluxe reverb amp (level 2-3, never higher then this, subtile but it is there)
kapepper
and sorry for the oversized picture ?
mtmattan
I'll likely get shot down for saying this in a GUITAR forum, but the guitar is still only 1 instrument with 1 sound.
All the original great sounds have been done already eg: a Tube Screamer complementing a Fender Amp. No one at this point in history is going to revolutionize the guitar and the way it sounds. That's why I tend towards versatility and stompboxes with many options.
I completely understand the appeal of a simple and elegant guitar and amp combo. But I also see what modern experimental bands ( Radiohead, Bloc Party, Muse etc) have done to push boundaries to create wondrous results.
Please take what I say with a pinch of salt - it's just a rambling ?
MIKA-the-better-one
Radiohead are a great example of a band that does not use multi Fx units ?
truth be said there sounds are very explanatory..... I love them for that
needleshy
i traded all my single pedal units in for a decent multi fx unit and i have not missed any of my pedals, although i am only using 3 or 4 effects on the unit it suits me very well, i didn't purchase a unit for "drive tones", the amps i have all have killer drives so it was just delay, chorus and phasers that i wanted and the unit gives me many more options for the future if i need it.
There are also many great and respectable guitarist who use multi fx units like Steve Lukather, as an example, who is one of the greatest guitarists and songwriters IMO.
With amps going the midi capable route like the JVM's etc there's no more need to tap dance or stress about switching 3 pedals on at the same time, after all we are rockers who wanna rock out on stage and not do a river dance like Michael Flatley ?, or i sure as hell don't anymore.
MIKA-the-better-one
For me there is a great deal of excitement in watching musicians use there gear, and for me "rocking out" is this..... I dont get the same satisfaction from a multi fx you can simply program...
There is a human element for me.
Granted we all share seperate circles of music but in mine, I generally have never noticed a multi fx....... and when I have strayed into seperate circles I am generally disapointed....
Here is a great example of a very unique guitarist/band.. who manages to be very creative with his slect pedals...... He plays them and knows them...... and I would not like it if he plopped some gt10 for this....
arjunmenon
needleshy wrote:
i traded all my single pedal units in for a decent multi fx unit and i have not missed any of my pedals, although i am only using 3 or 4 effects on the unit it suits me very well, i didn't purchase a unit for "drive tones", the amps i have all have killer drives so it was just delay, chorus and phasers that i wanted and the unit gives me many more options for the future if i need it.
There are also many great and respectable guitarist who use multi fx units like Steve Lukather, as an example, who is one of the greatest guitarists and songwriters IMO.
With amps going the midi capable route like the JVM's etc there's no more need to tap dance or stress about switching 3 pedals on at the same time, after all we are rockers who wanna rock out on stage and not do a river dance like Michael Flatley ?, or i sure as hell don't anymore.
Same here. It's convenient for me. I play into a ss amp and DI at church and it gives me the option to mimic a blackface sound for my cleans, have a H&K Triamp for my solos with just the right amount of delay etc etc all at a single stomp. Sure, it might not sound as awesome, but it gets pretty close. I also use it with a valve amp using a 4CM just for the effects, and it does a pretty good job here too.
If i had to go down the single effect unit route, i'd have to have roughly R20k to get the sounds i'm going for.
Neal Schon is another example of a multi-fx user.
singemonkey
It's at this point that I always have to chime in and remind folks that while analogue pedals are expensive, they retain their value after the initial drop (not at all if bought 2nd hand) so you'll get most of your money back selling. Digital multi-fx begin a sharp dive towards zero ront the minute they're released. So you pay less, but you'll end up throwing it away and paying again for the one with the new tech. Or you upgrade more quickly when you can still get half the value - but then you're buying more often too. It's the digital model ('scuse the pun).
Of course some digital individual effects go the same way too. I try to minimise those. Only my reverb is digital - and it will devalue.
nick
singemonkey wrote:
It's at this point that I always have to chime in and remind folks that while analogue pedals are expensive, they retain their value after the initial drop (not at all if bought 2nd hand) so you'll get most of your money back selling. Digital multi-fx begin a sharp dive towards zero ront the minute they're released. So you pay less, but you'll end up throwing it away and paying again for the one with the new tech. Or you upgrade more quickly when you can still get half the value - but then you're buying more often too. It's the digital model ('scuse the pun).
Of course some digital individual effects go the same way too. I try to minimise those. Only my reverb is digital - and it will devalue.
Very true, an 80s Boss pedal probably sells secondhand now for more than it cost to buy back then and people still want it. Anyone want a Zoom505? ?
