Peavey 6505+ head using Multi-FX headphone jack

inflames

Hi all,

I'm considering getting Peavey 6505+ from the states in June when a friend takes a jet for a service in Miami.

With the baby arriving in 4 weeks time, there is no way in heaven and hell that I can play this in my house!

So I read a interesting article, but don't understand it at all, maybe you can help.

I understand I need to run the head into a cab otherwise a big explosion will happen ?

Now the theory of this guy is that you can run the head into cab, but then use FX loop or pre-amp out to send the signal to a multi-fx unit.
Plug your earphones in and jam without using the cabinet for output.

This would be super cool and the only way I can think this will work is use the pre-amp out?

Thanks ladies and gents!

Tonedef

Doesn't the amp out pump at a hell of a level, which might kill your GT?

But why would you want to do this anyway? It simply won't sound the same without the cab, so you might as well model it with your GT. Or have I got the wrong end of the stick here? ???

ETA: Pish, I read like my butthole. It's a preamp out not an amp out :-[ Sure, you should be able to use your GT, or any mixing unit you've got.

It might be interesting to bugger around with stacking the GT's sim modelling/effects with the peavy's signal.

AlanRatcliffe

Yes you can do it, although you'll have to experiment a bit to get your sound. You need a blank jack in the return too, which cuts the signal between the pre and power amp (but safe because the speakers are still hooked up to the amp).

Another option is a dummy load (kind of an attenuator that damps all the output - often used by techs for bench testing) on the amp output that has a speaker simulated output. Can't remember a specific brand ATM, but I know they exist. Advantage there is you're getting the power amp drive too and only simulating the speakers instead of both power amp and speakers.

Tonedef

So the head MUST be loaded or it will go boom?

inflames

Tonedef wrote: So the head MUST be loaded or it will go boom?

Yes, with a valve head!
If you don't plug it into a cab you will blow your valves and even damage the rest of the components!

inflames

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: Yes you can do it, although you'll have to experiment a bit to get your sound. You need a blank jack in the return too, which cuts the signal between the pre and power amp (but safe because the speakers are still hooked up to the amp).

Great thanks, I forgot to mention the blank jack in the return!

Another option is a dummy load (kind of an attenuator that damps all the output - often used by techs for bench testing) on the amp output that has a speaker simulated output. Can't remember a specific brand ATM, but I know they exist. Advantage there is you're getting the power amp drive too and only simulating the speakers instead of both power amp and speakers.

So with the dummy load I don't need a cab? That will be even cooler! Well saves spending R14k on a Mesa cab!
Also getting the pre and power amp into the FX will be exactly what I'm looking for!
Thinking of getting the Line 6 POD X3 Pro rackmount to use for this. Need to keep thing a bit more tidy!

Alan, when you remember the unit's name I need, please let me know! Will also do do me googling!
+1 Alan

Tonedef

Sooo.... chewed on it a bit.

If you have a power amp with a volume knob - the volume knob actuates an attenuator (seeing as you have to load it)?
If you have a pre-amp with a volume knob - that's a simple pot arrangement on the pre-amp output?
And an power amp head with integrated pre-amp, the volume knob works either an attenuator on the power amp or is a volume pot on the pre-amp signal? Or maybe it has both....?

P.S +1 on the valve amp heads-up. I love this site, you learn important stuff every day (and you may have prevented me from making a costly future mistake!) ?

Gearhead

Tonedef wrote: If you have a power amp with a volume knob - the volume knob actuates an attenuator (seeing as you have to load it)?

Every pot in an amp works as an attenuator, that's why you have more than one gain stage. If you were to put all tone controls etc behind each other without intermediate gain stages, you would wind up with too little signal.
The attenuator you speak about on the power stage - it is not on the power stage or your pot would have to dissipate a lot of power. A master volume usually sits between the phase splitter and the power tubes, where the signal is still somewhat manageable.
If people speak about attenuators for tube amps, they usually mean power attenuators, which are indeed thingies that eat up signal from the power stage and turn it into heat - hence the cost.

Gearhead

inflames wrote: So with the dummy load I don't need a cab? That will be even cooler!

A dummy load is nothing but a resistor with a lot of thermal capacity, in other words you can put one together with locally available components quite easily.
If you screw this http://za.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=1074147 onto a heatsink, you will be klaar.

inflames

Gearhead wrote:
inflames wrote: So with the dummy load I don't need a cab? That will be even cooler!
A dummy load is nothing but a resistor with a lot of thermal capacity, in other words you can put one together with locally available components quite easily. Lemme see...

Thanks Gearhead, looking forward to your reply!
PS. I still have your coffee mug, send me your details and I will send you postage cost!

AlanRatcliffe

Remembered a few speaker sims: Palmer have a range, the Hughes and Kettner Red Box and Behringer have one too.Can't remember which have a dummy load too (definitely some of the Palmers). Not a biggie, as Gearhead said, you can build one pretty easily (or get someone to make you one).

inflames

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: Remembered a few speaker sims: Palmer have a range, the Hughes and Kettner Red Box and Behringer have one too.Can't remember which have a dummy load too (definitely some of the Palmers). Not a biggie, as Gearhead said, you can build one pretty easily (or get someone to make you one).

Great thanks! Just to confirm, with this option I don't need a cab?
Will see what Gearhead comes up with, will also chat to Graeme

Gearhead

Just look at my previous post, I changed it... ?

inflames

If you screw this http://za.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=1074147 onto a heatsink, you will be klaar.

Thanks Gearhead +!

kp247

inflames wrote: Hi all,

I'm considering getting Peavey 6505+ from the states in June when a friend takes a jet for a service in Miami.

With the baby arriving in 4 weeks time, there is no way in heaven and hell that I can play this in my house!

So I read a interesting article, but don't understand it at all, maybe you can help.

I understand I need to run the head into a cab otherwise a big explosion will happen ?

Now the theory of this guy is that you can run the head into cab, but then use FX loop or pre-amp out to send the signal to a multi-fx unit.
Plug your earphones in and jam without using the cabinet for output.

This would be super cool and the only way I can think this will work is use the pre-amp out?

Thanks ladies and gents!

I have to question your logic man? Why on earth buy the thing in the first place if you're not going to use it live. The 6505+ is a brute of an amp and was designed for live playing, not in a room with headphones ??? Why not just get one of these multi effect units that comes with headphone outputs?

inflames

I have to question your logic man? Why on earth buy the thing in the first place if you're not going to use it live. The 6505+ is a brute of an amp and was designed for live playing, not in a room with headphones Huh? Why not just get one of these multi effect units that comes with headphone outputs?

Ok, fair question ?

Well, the 6505+ is one of my to own amps and playing it with a Mesa cab is about as brutal as it gets.
I will surely take the amp out for walks in the park and get-togethers!

There is also no FX that can give you the sound of the amp, just my opinion!
So for owning the amp and playing it at my house when baby is asleep the headphones would be the solution!

Tonedef

Maybe that's exactly what he wants it for, but for home use he wants the sound without the decibels.

BMU

..or a Roland Cube or something. Or heck if you have a laptop/PC standing around, some of the excellent free amp sim VSTs & cab impulses floating around will sort you out great. Just asking... ?

inflames

BMU wrote: ..or a Roland Cube or something. Or heck if you have a laptop/PC standing around, some of the excellent free amp sim VSTs & cab impulses floating around will sort you out great. Just asking... ?

Well the Cube is a great little amp (solid state), played it and will recommend it to people looking for a start up amp.
PC is also not a problem and there is some super cool applications for playing guitar. Just not a fan of it.

Still Peavey 6505+ vs Cube + PC = major fail ?

Gearhead

inflames wrote: There is also no FX that can give you the sound of the amp, just my opinion!

An amp without the power stage interacting with a speaker & cab will not give you the sound you're looking for either.
Imho if it is for practice, all you need is to be able to hear yourself. Sand amps are good enough for practicing most things and for the feel of an amp at full tilt you must practice with the amp at full tilt.