a question re cymbals and how they work for the technical bofs

Keira-WitherKay

hi ya . i have a question .....and it's prob not possible........ but before i do this as in experiment by cutting a cymbal i want some advice.........

right i use a splash cymbal in my stage act and it's close mic'd so sounds pretty BIG in mix........ now for my travel setup .yes a compact travel setup is my "hobby" ? so always seeking idea's .so what i want to do is find out if a cymbal will still ring if it's not a circle........ so if i take an 8" splash cymbal and cut a wedge out of it like a slice if cake with the centre still intact but then it fans out ..... so in fact using only maybe a 1/4 or even 1/6th of the whole round cymbal.if i close mic it will it still chime as before or does the round design dictate that .so basically if it works i could just use a wedge of a cymbal instead of the whole one...and cut down on space /weight ect and it need'nt be loud as close mic'ing will provide volume as long as it has a cymbal sound however soft

so one for the technical bofs

ezietsman

Keira WitherKay wrote: hi ya . i have a question .....and it's prob not possible........ but before i do this as in experiment by cutting a cymbal i want some advice.........

right i use a splash cymbal in my stage act and it's close mic'd so sounds pretty BIG in mix........ now for my travel setup .yes a compact travel setup is my "hobby" ? so always seeking idea's .so what i want to do is find out if a cymbal will still ring if it's not a circle........ so if i take an 8" splash cymbal and cut a wedge out of it like a slice if cake with the centre still intact but then it fans out ..... so in fact using only maybe a 1/4 or even 1/6th of the whole round cymbal.if i close mic it will it still chime as before or does the round design dictate that .so basically if it works i could just use a wedge of a cymbal instead of the whole one...and cut down on space /weight ect and it need'nt be loud as close mic'ing will provide volume as long as it has a cymbal sound however soft

so one for the technical bofs

I believe cymbals sound like they do because of the waves moving around in them. Think of it this way, a thin piece of flat metal won't ring nicely when you tap it right? It just goes 'tik'. It becomes louder and rings more the bigger you make it (everyone have heard the sound of big pieces of sheet metal flexing right?) So I don't think cutting a cymbal into a wedge will work. Maybe I'm being thick...

Tonedef

Yeah I think ez man has the right of it- it wont resonate in the same way if its not round. Think of it like ripples in a tub of water, if the tub is round, the ripples expand and reflect off the sides, and interact with each other in a smooth, elegant way. If the tub has corners and shard edges, the ripples are all over the place with no harmony in the movement. At least, thats what I see in my minds eye, I might be wrong applying this to a cymbal but it makes sense to me. Best way is to get a cracked one, have at it with an angle grinder and see.

killafo

I actually know someone who tried this, not because he wanted a smaller cymbal but because his alcohol level was greater than his willingness to think straight.
So no it doesn't work.

\m/

raithza

plenty of videos around like this...

and

that should give you an idea why it probably wont work ?

arjunmenon

There are a few educated drummers around here who can help you KW. Alan, if i'm not mistaken, is also a keen drummer.

From what i understand( this is from hanging around drummers...pls add salt to taste), a cut cymbal (unless you're going for a specific effect) will have:

1. Badly defined attack
2. Inconsistent tone
3. Poor sustain & release

~~Have you looked at the smaller splashes instead of crashes. Paiste, Sabian & Zildjian (especially the K series ones) all have nice spalshes.~~
Cheers

PS - Just noticed now that, as per you OP, you're using a splash. My bad.

raithza

Arjun Menon wrote: 3. Poor sustain & release

How do you differentiate a cymbal's sustain from its release? ???

arjunmenon

raithza wrote:
Arjun Menon wrote: 3. Poor sustain & release

How do you differentiate a cymbal's sustain from its release? ???

Pretty much the same way you'd judge the sustain of a guitar. Hit cymbal, sudden increase in volume (higher attack), sound evens out (sustain), sounds starts decreasing (release)...unless i'm totally off the path here talking BS.

FruitarGeek

Keira. I have a drumkit here. And even a slight crack in a cymbal will change its tone radically. Nevermind playing on a small pizza slice. Im sorry to say, but it will sound like you hitting a tiny piece of metal. It wont resonate.

Keira-WitherKay

thanks for the responces.yeah i had a feeling i was barking up the wrong tree..... but my entire live kit has evolved by thinking outside the box..some idea's work some don't and i hope i never stop "scheming" on how to make this whole setup do the pro gigs i do and still pack into a small carry bag so i can carry all my kit in one trip...... and happy to report i'm winning in many ways...... for intimate gigs ( most of what i do ) i'm down to 1x powered speaker( 12' & horn 550W ) and a huge gig bag like those ones from cape union mart for the percussion gear /stands /stool ect and my guitar in a gig bag i can move it in one trip .but it's still too heavy and i need a trolley to get it about ......but as i mentioned it's a process of constant evolution ......