Backline for gigs

Skywalker

A wierd thought entered my head while jamming the other day.

I started running over my list of things to get ready for our gig at the 5th annual Animals Rock concert this weekend.

http://www.guitarforum.co.za/guitar-events/rocking-for-a-good-cause/

One of the things on my list was "backline".

In this case the organisers are pretty sorted with gear ( as they usually are for shows like this with a ton of bands playing over 2 days) BUT what about playing other venues around town?

Does anyone have a problem with organising backline for their gigs? More specifically guitar and bass amps and drum kits. I know most people have their own gear and end up sharing gear with other bands but don't you think it's a mission to lug it around all over the place and take the risk of your gear getting nicked or damaged? Also sometimes the gear that's organised is sub standard or not working properlly which makes for a dismal gig!

Would band members hire the equipment they need for their gigs if we had the resources like in the UK or USA? I'm sure there are plenty of places that offer these services around S.A but from what I've seen they concentrate mainly on PA and front of house sound, lighting and "events planning" etc.

Where would I go if I wanted to hire an amp for the weekend or if our band needed a drum kit for a gig because the venue doesn't have one? Likewise if I needed a rocking amp or gear to record with?

Share with me your thoughts and opinoins 8)

AlanRatcliffe

Quite frankly I don't think there are enough mid- to large-sized bands (or studios - don't forget the studio hire market) around to make it viable. Most of the larger international touring bands who come here are getting their gear from the big sound hire guys, so you don't get that market. Local bands also don't travel as much by air as bands do in the US, so are more likely to have access to their own gear.

Anyway, it's an expensive investment and much of the gear is relatively high maintenance and prone to abuse and theft. And maintenance is not just keeping things like amps serviced and replacing the small drum kit bits that go missing. If you get a call that an amp has gone down at a gig, you have to be able to fix it or replace it at a moment's notice.

MIKA-the-better-one

Doing a few small to mid sized gigs around jhb and pta, I constantly have the issue of other bands asking to use our drum kit and bass amp, even guitar amps fro mtime to time.
I must admit I often reply with the answer "its very unproffesional to borrow gear"
So we never lend gear to any bands, especially when the excuse is something like "we are travelling from along way and cannot bring ours" "its very heavy" "we think it would be easier"

I just say no. Becasue while i was in USA and UK bands did not lend there gear, because its there personal sound tailored to them... Why should another band benifit off my bassists ampeg svt 4 pro head and 4 by 10 cab, when all the ther bands basist bought a little hartke...

With drums I understand using the shells of one kit, usually the band that organises, but NOT cymbals or snare....

Even if a venue provdes a decent bass amp, we still use our own, because we know it and its sound.

I think tis just more pro to do it that way, plus anyone who complaines they dont want ot carry a big amp in my band does not last long ?

ryanguit

Amen to Mika

Skywalker

Some good points ?

I guess what I'm trying to get opinion on here is IF there were companies out there( in S.A that is) that had an ampeg svt 4 pro head and 4 by 10 cab or whatever amp you used, would you make use of their services instead of lugging your gear around from gig to gig?

I for one would consider it if said company had the means to get a JCM2000 and 4x12 or 2x12(never mind the rest of the gear ?) to our gigs, set it up, break it down and take it back after the show. Don't get me wrong here. I'm sure not a lazy person(in fact I dig hauling and setting our gear up and breaking it down) but wouldn't it be alot easier and less time consuming?

So we never lend gear to any bands, especially when the excuse is something like "we are travelling from along way and cannot bring ours" "its very heavy" "we think it would be easier"

I'm not too keen most times to let other bands use my amp/s. There are a select few of my mates, however, that I'm ok with to use my gear.

With drums I understand using the shells of one kit, usually the band that organises, but NOT cymbals or snare....

I'm with you on that one Mika.

needleshy

if i was in a pop band that brings in much needed cash, and the price is right i would, provided they can supply me with the rig i usually use, i would rent to make things easier while touring, etc

Reinhard

Maybe start a Rent-a-Roadie service. They carry all the heavy stuff, set up your gear, soundcheck and on you go and play. They could even provide spare 9V batteriesn cables, mics etc if a crisis occurs ?

AlanRatcliffe

Skywalker wrote: wouldn't it be alot easier and less time consuming?

Yes, but for many smaller bands it would boil down to more expensive and therefore not an option.

I don't mind sharing backline by arrangement with other acts on the bill. Makes sense from a setup viewpoint and makes life easy for the engineer. You could also find yourself in a similar situation another time and need the favour returned. Anyway, the opening band are part of the show, so if your gear makes them come off better, then it makes the whole show better for the audience. If they suck because their guitarist is using a 20W Valvestate, the audience might not be in a good mood by the time you climb onstage. Even if there is no arrangement, I'd probably allow it (although if the other band jut turned up without gear and then asked to use mine they might not share a bill with me again).

PeteM

This thread is interesting particularly since I have just seen a post from one of my friends on FB who is looking to hire a guitar amp for backline for a staging at the ICC here in Durban. Maybe there is a demand. He didn't specify the amp - just offered R350 for the one gig.

MIKA-the-better-one

As mentioned for small bands who would essentially use such a sevice in SA, as thats about all there are in this country ... small bands. Expenses would hinder one from utuilizing such a service.

Funny enough I have found myself in a situation where by I was SCREWED blowing a preamp tube and a bit more before a show...... and because of this I keep a few things handy, 1)spare tubes 2)some close friends who can and will lend me an amp if needed 3) I go to backline companies if needed as I have there numbers 4) my booking agents have amps n hand for international bands coming to SA

So with all that I found myself using a Vox ac30 heritage handwired. Why? Because I planned and I care about my tone.

Yes if some poor bands amp blows up on stage, he can probably use mine, but if that poor band has brought the crappest gear ever, and I am expecting it to break down, he is less likely to eartn my sympathy.

In the way of lending gear for the good of the show, I just havent experienced that...... I recently played a show, with my usual sound guy. We had given this new band a opening slot to Jam, they showed up with little marshall valve state amps, sounded SHOCKing!!!! Treble and Ear raping occured........ but that was there issue, most people went outside and waited till it was over. The sound guy spoke to me, and we just had them play very low, We wont gig with them again. very simple.

Even before I had semi decent gear I didnt borrow amps, I used what i had cuz I knew it best, and I knew that I was working towards better things.

Sorry I got sidetracked........ Recently when ASH from the UK came out, they had to borrow guitar amps from my friend cuz the company that brought them gave them MESA rectifiers, and they wanted Fender hot rods... so there is a need for a decent backline company.....
Music Connection usually lend out gear though. its just so much cash

singemonkey

PeteM wrote: This thread is interesting particularly since I have just seen a post from one of my friends on FB who is looking to hire a guitar amp for backline for a staging at the ICC here in Durban. Maybe there is a demand. He didn't specify the amp - just offered R350 for the one gig.

Doesn't sound worth it - unless the amp's a real cheapy. So much could go wrong.

In South Africa it would probably be cheaper to hire a roadie. Of course, most rock bands are too hip to be seen employing unskilled labour in South Africa (although the logic escapes me a little). But given the cost of a single, unskilled person working per hour - who could be trained to set up and break down your gear - it'd be a lot cheaper than hiring a company to set up and break down their duplicates of gear you already have.

The other side issue... do guitar players still have any reason to use a speaker cabinet with 4 speakers in it? Under what conditions is that useful?

Heh. I once lent a guy my Pacifica, and he had the gall to look pissed that I didn't lend him my (much more fragile) Les Paul. Even if it's an old Hondo, you should have a back up guitar.

TomCat

There is a company in Jozi specializing in Backline gear. Cannot remember the name off the top of my head but it was started by the bassist from PJ Powers. He is based in Midrand if memory serves me correctly. I know he does rental for a lot of the big shows.