George Gruhn on the shift in guitar making to Asia

singemonkey

This if off the japanaxe site. George Gruhn is a well known expert on guitars and their value. I just recently bought an '83 Guitar Player magazine. His column in that about the differences in '50s and '70s Ramirezs astonished me with the depth of his knowledge.

Here he is talking about the shift over the years of manufacturing from America, to Japan, to Korea, to Indonesia, and then finally to China. A bit long, but interesting I thought:

http://www.japanaxe.com/Article_06_08_02.htm

Bob-Dubery

singemonkey wrote: This if off the japanaxe site. George Gruhn is a well known expert on guitars and their value. I just recently bought an '83 Guitar Player magazine. His column in that about the differences in '50s and '70s Ramirezs astonished me with the depth of his knowledge.

Here he is talking about the shift over the years of manufacturing from America, to Japan, to Korea, to Indonesia, and then finally to China. A bit long, but interesting I thought:

http://www.japanaxe.com/Article_06_08_02.htm

Ole George is a walking encyclopaedia. He certainly knows his onions.

I found this article very interesting.

I thought it touched on some interesting points - though it maybe that I'm reading between lines and then filtering what I find through the bees in my bonnet (or something....)

by 1974 the more progressive Japanese manufacturers were well aware that many vintage American instruments were far superior to the new ones of that time. As a result some of these Japanese manufacturers stared to concentrate on studying vintage American originals.

Which is really what companies like Collings and Santa Cruz are about. They're really making copies of pre-war Martins and Gibsons. Admittedly the guitars are very high quality (with prices to match) but these guys are not really innovating. But they're not perceived as copy cats in the way that, say, Tokai are.

Also interesting to see how "American" brands are increasingly taking their manufacturing overseas.

The comments about CBS-Fender's profit margins are interesting, as are George's observations (and who am I to argue) that in many cases contemporary MIM Fenders play better than late CBS-era MIA Fenders (though that may not be saying a lot).

Interesting too that a guy who has made so much money out of trading in the collectibles market can still see guitars in terms of intrinsic quality and playability, not just as investment instruments.

singemonkey

X-rated Bob wrote:
by 1974 the more progressive Japanese manufacturers were well aware that many vintage American instruments were far superior to the new ones of that time. As a result some of these Japanese manufacturers stared to concentrate on studying vintage American originals.
Which is really what companies like Collings and Santa Cruz are about. They're really making copies of pre-war Martins and Gibsons. Admittedly the guitars are very high quality (with prices to match) but these guys are not really innovating. But they're not perceived as copy cats in the way that, say, Tokai are.

I think that the Gibson/Fender guitars are just the bread and butter of Japanese guitar makers. Every brand - even those well respected elsewhere for their own designs - seem to make clones of these guitars. Some are really good and really expensive, but in general it seems like the Japanese players would rather have a Gibson or MIA Fender if they can get one. Tokai somewhat specialise in clones, although their aluminium bodied Talbo is fairly well-known and quite unique.

But ultimately I think this issue is a non-issue. ?

Also interesting to see how "American" brands are increasingly taking their manufacturing overseas.

And have been for years. This build in China with quality control at home approach seems a winning bet for a manufacturer. The evidence would be PRS's SE line and ESP's Edwards line - both of which have a reputation for quality.

I like how he identifies the true power of China's manufacturing sector - cheap, skilled, labour. And given their authoritarian government, they're in a position to maintain that for longer than Japan did.

The comments about CBS-Fender's profit margins are interesting, as are George's observations (and who am I to argue) that in many cases contemporary MIM Fenders play better than late CBS-era MIA Fenders (though that may not be saying a lot).

Well, I think this is the elephant in the room that die-hard apologists for the American companies won't acknowledge. That the only possible reason that the American products could be that much more expensive than Japanese (where the labour, space, equipment costs are the same or higher), is excessive mark up.

Interesting too that a guy who has made so much money out of trading in the collectibles market can still see guitars in terms of intrinsic quality and playability, not just as investment instruments.

I guess that's how you get into it and stay interested. I'm sure there are quite a few art dealers out there who are just nuts about the works that they trade.