Wizard's first build attempt

Wizard · 2009-10-31T14:59:27+00:00

Bought the wood. A 3m stretch of Alder planed to 46mm supposedly; actually 50mm: Cut out 5 blanks. This one has a large knot ... so am using this as my first attempt: Using a circular saw & jigsaw got the first rough cut. Then smoothed with belt sander:

MikeM

It will angle the neck towards the floor, ala Les Paul ?

AlanRatcliffe

^^ Yup. Angles I'm not sure off hand (about a degree? A LP has about 2 deg. IIRC - and the TOM bridges are relatively high). I can say about .010" difference between the front and the back of the pocket will raise the strings about 1/16" at the bridge pup.

MikeM

Alan, I am pulling this one from nowhere but if I remember it is actually between 3 and 5 degrees. But this is from what I read on MLP forum so can not say if the source was correct.

Gearhead

...3-5 degrees? that would have been a LP...

@Wizard: never mind the factual approach, as long as you understand the principle. Let me try to explain.

We are taking action out of the equation since the same player will like this the same on the same guitar. We also do not look at bridge height since we would like to keep that as a final adjustment, having completed the guitar build. So, we now need to plan to get the strings running at a certain distance from the fretboard straight onto the bridge.

Draw a side view of a body with bridge and then draw lines at random angles away from the saddle top: any of these could be the line of your strings. With some the neck will be missing the body altogether whereas with others the line of the strings will go through the body. None of these are very practical. :-\

You are hopefully beginning to see that there are two factors that influence overall bridge height: neck pocket depth and neck pocket tilt angle.
If you have very little neck pocket depth the neck sits very high on the body and therefore you will need an angle away from the body. The disadvantage is that the pickups will come to sit very high up from the body and that your neck now points away from the player's arm.
If you have very much pocket depth the reverse is true: your guitar will be more comfortable to play since it almost 'wraps around your body' because of the down angle you need to get action and bridge height in line. Les Pauls are like this, you can see that the bottom of the fretboard not even clears the body top on a single cutaway. To hide this, they carve the top at a down angle as well. They also put the bridge considerably higher than on a Fender et voilà, it works.

Coming back to the Fenders: what you need to do to get it right is to draw a cross section of the guitar smack on the centerline. Now you forget about neck relief and draw in body, neck (at a depth so that the top of the pickguard is roughly level with the bottom of the fretboard) , bridge (at, say, two thirds of the saddle height adjustment) and action, and you will find that there is only one angle that gets it right.

If there are too many puzzled now, I can be persuaded to post a diagram but it is not going to be easy ☹

Wizard

Thanks Gearhead - makes tremendous sense.
Although has required a fair amount of 3D visualisation to get it all going in my head.

Summarising what I've heard:
The neck and bridge are a system in their own right ... which need to be perfectly aligned; and this system is attached to the body.

There are a large number of ways in which this "system" can be attached to the body ... which influence the comfort of the neck angle; the height of the bridge above the body; the height of the pickups on the body; and the "shreddiness" of the saddle adjusters.

I now see one of the major benefits of a neck-through design; where this neck/bridge "system" is all made on the same piece of wood.
(drawback is that you have to make your own neck)

Thinking aloud:
There's something to be said for cutting the neck pocket very early in the process ... thus establishing a good neck/body connection;
... then shaping the body afterwards to ensure the bridge height and position is correct.

As an amateur woodworker I have to think of where I'm most likely to make my errors and make sure I give myself the greatest degrees of freedom to adjust for them elsewhere.

I'm currently building a jig for cutting the neck pocket.
Will post pictures when I'm finished.

Wizard

First phase of neck pocket jig complete.
Needed a few rebuilds to correct design flaws - but works very well now.

The jig is a frame with adjustable guides for the router.

Clamp the neck inside the guides:

Ready for routing:

Here's a sample I've tried (recognize the neck Gearhead?)
The fit is tight enough that I can suspend the "body" by holding the neck

Next step:
Upgrade jig with an appropriately shaped "stopper" for the end of the neck.
Currently doing it by eye which is sub-optimal.

Manfred-Klose

the jig is looking good.
is that kiaat i am seeing there?

Wizard

Rhodesian Teak.
Yes - way overkill.
But it's as tough as nails and therefore well suited to jig making.
I had some lying around that was destined to become marimba frames ... but this is more important to me at the moment ?

MikeM

Rhodesian teak is some SERIOUSLY strong stuff. Considered trying some for a neck sometime.. How stiff is it?

Wizard

MikeM wrote Rhodesian teak is some SERIOUSLY strong stuff. Considered trying some for a neck sometime.. How stiff is it?

Have no idea regarding its suitability for necks.
But it's pretty damn tough stuff.
Snapped off a drill bit while making a hole with my drill press !!

Wizard

I cut the neck pocket this afternoon.
Stuffed it up.
I had a shaped block to limit the router at the body end.
The block moved while I was routing ☹

Well ... the error will be under the pickguard, but not ideal.

It has occurred to me though that the neck pocket jig has cost me more than the body wood ?
And this was the trial and error blank I was working on.

My next puzzle - how do you line up the holes in the neck for drilling into the body?

AlanRatcliffe

Wizard wrote My next puzzle - how do you line up the holes in the neck for drilling into the body?

Usually you don't - you drill the body holes first and use them to drill the neck holes. Place your neck plate in the pocket and mark the positions for drilling the body. If your neck holes don't line up with the body holes, plug them with dowels and glue and then redrill.

Wizard

... you drill the body holes first and use them to drill the neck holes.
Place your neck plate in the pocket and mark the positions for drilling the body.
If your neck holes don't line up with the body holes, plug them with dowels and glue and then redrill.

So simple when you know how ... ?
Thanks Alan - will do that.

Gearhead

Should you have a neck with holes in, there is another way. You take a piece of perspex 4mm, stick it onto the back of the neck with double sided tape and copy the holes. You then rout around the template and neck with the 'copy up' router bit. The template can then be put into the pocket and the holes copied. ?

AlanRatcliffe

Gearhead wrote You take a piece of perspex 4mm, stick it onto the back of the neck with double sided tape and copy the holes.

Very cool!

Wizard

Here's my progress on cutting the neck pocket and some body shaping:

Ready to start cutting. Notice new "stopper" jig:

Pocket cut:

Sample loose fit:

Sample loose fit of guitar so far:

Wizard

Routed out the body cavities.
Template slipped while routing the hole for the jack, so a little oversized:

but error hidden (fortunately) by the cover plate:

AlanRatcliffe

That's beginning to take shape. Well done!

Renesongs

Looking good. That dirty great knot must of given your router a bit of trouble when you were cutting the cavity for the tone pots.

Wizard

Renesongs wrote Looking good. That dirty great knot must of given your router a bit of trouble when you were cutting the cavity for the tone pots.

I was expecting it to give trouble ... but it was crumbly ... so it just fell away.
The body looks a lot better without it though
?

I'm busy contemplating buying this from gumtree; stripping it for parts ... as I continue to put together my "learner-build" guitar:
http://capetown.gumtree.co.za/c-Stuff-for-Sale-musical-instruments-Immaculate-STRAT-copy-electric-guitar-by-Hamer-W0QQAdIdZ175945144

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