Acoustic setup for fingerstyle.

Cellie

Okay, what I now about setting up an acoustic guitar is probably akin to a (good) B-grade horror movie i.e. all the fright minus the budget... if that makes sense. ?

From the bit of reading I've done I've made the following conclusions:

1. The lower the action the better.

2. Use medium- to light gauge strings.

3. There's talk about ivory/bone bridge pins influencing tone? Yes?

My Epiphone Caballero's bridge has been so worn-in by the strings to the point where the pins don't hold them down anymore. The result is that my high E and B strings keep shooting/popping out, sending pins flying. I've also noticed that my high E's tuner keeps losing "grip" on the string even as I tune it up.

Now, there is a guy who lives close by, probably the only person in P.E., that can/is doing repairs. I trust his judgment and I've had him set up my guitars before. I'd just like some more info from the guys in the know.

I assume that I'll be needing a new bridge made and probably get some new tuners. Any info/suggestions/advice/recommendations would be *greatly* appreciated.

From what I've gathered this guitar was made in Japan in the 70's. It has such a wonderful, warm, full sound for such a small body and I'd like to keep it as close to it's roots as possible re. modding/repairs.

Thanks!

MikeM

I am interested to see Bob's sentiments about action ? I like all my guitars to have a medium action (Typically on the high side for most people) and medium strings on my acoustic..

Is it definitely the tuners and not just the way it is being strung? Personally I think any material besides plastic is good for nuts/saddles..

Sounds like a nice guitar ?

Bob-Dubery

Cellie wrote: From the bit of reading I've done I've made the following conclusions:

1. The lower the action the better.

That's down to style and personal preference. Bluegrass players often (for reasons I don't understand) like the action a little on the high side. Some also assert that action effects tone because it changes the way the strings break over the saddle. This theory says that the lower the action the worse the tone - but that's also at least partly a matter of personal taste.

2. Use medium- to light gauge strings.

Also subjective, but generally the heavier the string the better the tone. I recently had a Smoothtalker guitar made by Mervyn Davis (see www.smoothtalkerguitars.com). He usually strings them with 11s and sets up with those strings on. I told him I planned to put 13s on because that's what I have on my Morgan. He fitted a set of 13s the day I came to do the "test drive". He said he'd never heard a Smoothtalker sound so good and wanted to switch to 13s as his standard because the guitars sounded better.

If you must have lights (12s on an acoustic) then try Phosphor Bronze strings. The material is heavier, so for the same guage you get more tension and also more vibrating mass and thus a bigger (IMO) tone.

But there's a lot of folks out there using 12s and 11s on acoustics. I don't know what Tony Rice uses, but it's pretty light by acoustic standards.

3. There's talk about ivory/bone bridge pins influencing tone? Yes?

Yes. BUt I'm not saying it's BETTER. Tusq and similar materials are very dense and hard and a different ball game from el cheapo plastic pins, so don't discount them. Let your ear be your guide. The most amazing acoustic tone I have ever heard came from Martin Carthy, and he uses brass bridge pins on the first 3 strings.

Of course if your guitar has no bridge pins then this an academic debate (Lowden have "through" bridges. Smoothtalkers have a trapeze tailpiece. I used to own a Takamine that had a "trough" bridge).

My Epiphone Caballero's bridge has been so worn-in by the strings to the point where the pins don't hold them down anymore. The result is that my high E and B strings keep shooting/popping out, sending pins flying. I've also noticed that my high E's tuner keeps losing "grip" on the string even as I tune it up.

Now, there is a guy who lives close by, probably the only person in P.E., that can/is doing repairs. I trust his judgment and I've had him set up my guitars before. I'd just like some more info from the guys in the know.

I assume that I'll be needing a new bridge made and probably get some new tuners. Any info/suggestions/advice/recommendations would be *greatly* appreciated.

From what I've gathered this guitar was made in Japan in the 70's. It has such a wonderful, warm, full sound for such a small body and I'd like to keep it as close to it's roots as possible re. modding/repairs

Maybe take a look at www.frets.com in general and specifically
http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier/Technique/Guitar/Bridges/StringRamps/stringramp.html

Or just try oversize pins. Graphtec make Tusq bridge pins in different sizes.

Bob-Dubery

X-rated Bob wrote:
Cellie wrote: From the bit of reading I've done I've made the following conclusions:

1. The lower the action the better.
That's down to style and personal preference. Bluegrass players often (for reasons I don't understand) like the action a little on the high side. Some also assert that action effects tone because it changes the way the strings break over the saddle. This theory says that the lower the action the worse the tone - but that's also at least partly a matter of personal taste.

One key difference in set up between acoustic and electric is the bridge. On electrics the bridge is adjustable. On acoustics it has to be cut down. It might be an idea to err on the side of being too high initially because you can always cut a little more off. If it's too low you have to shim and you might find that effects the tone a little.

Bob-Dubery

Cellie wrote:
From what I've gathered this guitar was made in Japan in the 70's. It has such a wonderful, warm, full sound for such a small body and I'd like to keep it as close to it's roots as possible re. modding/repair

OK. so it's somewhere between 30 and 40 years old now. It may need a neck reset.

Cellie

Thanks Bob, appreciate the feedback.

I actually had the neck looked at as soon as I received the guitar about two years ago. It was a bit twisted so my go-to guy put it through one of those heated press thingies which sorted it out. The other problem was that the neck had a slight crack just below the nut where the neck meets the headstock. He suggested I don't go too heavy on the strings as it might place too much pressure on the headstock and worsen the crack considerably. It's a bolt-on neck.

I currently have said el-cheapo plastic pins which I'll be replacing with something you suggested. They're completely wasted by now anyway.

AlanRatcliffe

I like a low action on acoustic for fingerstyle - but I'm primarily an electric and nylon player so steel strings hurt me at the best of times. Higher action and heavier strings do sound better (subjectively speaking), so if you can play the guitar like that and are happy, no reason to change.

Swap the bridge pins out before you look at repairing the bridge. Nine times out of ten that fixes things. Material - anything but soft plastic. Replacing plastic, it's hard to go wrong with bone, fossilised ivory or Tusq - exactly which is "best" is down to the nitpicky player and the guitar itself.

Personally, I would fix the neck crack ASAP (stitch in time, and all that...). Simple glue injection and clamping.

Keira-WitherKay

as far as action and gauge strings goes......... i would want to know if you gonna play primarily unplugged or mic'd or with pickup through an amp............. cos many fingerpickers i know who play through an amp mostly actually play softly and acoustically would hardly be heard.... then they use lighter strings and low actions... to make the playing easier .......but if you need to get volume outa a steel string acoustically then thinker strings and higher action and hope you have the hand strength for it hehehh ..........so yeah it's all up to personal preferance........

but like BB king said why play on "railroad tracks" if you want a fatter sound just turn up the amp........... (this was said to billy gibbons of zz top btw )

good luck hope you find a nice fit

peace and light
keira
ps .. i only play fingerstyle and i always have a low low action but on nylon

Bob-Dubery

Cellie wrote: I actually had the neck looked at as soon as I received the guitar about two years ago. It was a bit twisted so my go-to guy put it through one of those heated press thingies which sorted it out. The other problem was that the neck had a slight crack just below the nut where the neck meets the headstock. He suggested I don't go too heavy on the strings as it might place too much pressure on the headstock and worsen the crack considerably. It's a bolt-on neck.

It's going to go eventually. Get it done. Then you don't have to compromise on strings.

If you can't get the repair done in the E Cape and you value the guitar then take a trip down to Cape Town.