Rock song

Wessel

Hi!

Would like to get some comments on my Rock bands first demo.The bands name is Back to Vinyl. (we incorporate old and new school influences in our music)

I used Cubase SX3 with the guitar rig 3 plug inn (A modified version of the Stray Cats sound with more gain). The drums was programmed on EZdrummer. I played on my Jackson RR3 with dime bag pick-ups straight into my interface (Behringer BCA2000).

What can I do to make it sound better ? And any ideas for panning the tracks better would be welcome as I think that is a big problem. Aswell as the overall mastering.

The track is uploaded here http://www.box.net/shared/p0r9e8c5iu

The recording is also on our facebook page and myspace. and www.myspace.com/backtovinylband

Hope you guys like it. ?

JohnnyReggae

Nice song, enjoyed it. Has a nice groove to it. Can't really comment to much on the technical aspects of the recording, other than it sounds a little "thin". I would double up the guitars to start with if you haven't done that already. Advice I received from a sound engineer friend regarding recording guitars. Record the guitar multiple times, then pan them around. Avoid panning hard-left and hard-right. Also try split the pan on a single channel itself, Cubase has that functionality (right click in pan area will give you different options). Another thing to try is use different EQ settings on different guitar channels in order to bring out or suppress different areas of the same guitar sound.

Another thing to remember is a little bit of EQ'ing can go a long way to giving you a better "fuller" sound. Found a very useful link with regards to EQ and what frequency ranges different instruments work in. Very useful if you're trying to make the guitar sound stand out for eg.

Link: http://www.recordingwebsite.com/articles/eqprimer.php

AlanRatcliffe

Good pop/rock number with potential there - type of thing that's fun to produce. Vocalist influenced by the indy pop stuff like Katrina and the Waves, B52s and local outfit The Sunshines?

OK, the panning is off - too much happening in the centre. Move the guitar out to one side a bit and pan the slapback echo to the opposite side (which will help clarify the guitar too). Keep main vox up the middle and pan the backing vox a little wider, so they don't interfere with the guitar.

Speaking guitar, I would either drop the slapback (which would be a shame) or back off on the overdrive of the lead guitar - it's a bit too gainy for that kind of sound, IMO. You've got a bit of harshness in there too - which isn't in keeping with the song and is making the whole mix a bit harsh, so I'd probably want to cut somewhere between 2KHz and 4KHz to try tame it a bit.

Levels - Where's the bass? It's almost completely lost - better in the chorus, but sometimes it sounds more like a bassy rhythm guitar part. You've got the toms cranked up too much too - particularly the low one causes problems in the more frenetic fills.

You sometimes falter at the worst places - usually coming in a fraction early or late at the beginning of a phrase (like on the first beat after the intro drum fill and the first note of the final solo). Loved the Bumblefootish riff at 2:02, BTW...

All I can think of for now...

NorioDS

Wow, Alan! "All I can think of for now" ?!?! You're amazing dude. You should consider charging for this sort of advice.

Eg: FixMySong.co.za - People upload and then pay R50-R300 for the critique. Could work ya know? ?

Wessel

Wow thank you Allan.

Exactly what I needed! I am going to try and follow your advice and will post the updated version soon. Haha I have allot to do so might take a while.

Wessel

Almost forgot

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:You sometimes falter at the worst places - usually coming in a fraction early or late at the beginning of a phrase (like on the first beat after the intro drum fill and the first note of the final solo). Loved the Bubblefootish riff at 2:02, BTW...

It was a 8th note pause I originally wrote into the song to create an feel of anticipation....But it consequently did not work out ☹ its a little bit longer when we do it live though but gonna scrap it on the recording. The same intro solo is the outro solo aswell so it happens the two times you mentioned. It is insane that you even picked it up!

AlanRatcliffe

Norio wrote: You should consider charging for this sort of advice. Eg: FixMySong.co.za - People upload and then pay R50-R300 for the critique. Could work ya know? ?

? It's a good pop song that I'd like to hear realise it's potential - I might have offered to work on it, but it's Cubase and I'm a Cubase noob. Ugh - can you imagine having to crit bad stuff though? If you're being paid for it you are automatically biased - and what if the song had no redeeming features whatsoever? What do you say? "Nice try"?

Wessel J Geldenhuys wrote: It is insane that you even picked it up!

Fresh ears and all that... While recording we tend to get too close to a song and it's difficult to take a step back and listen objectively. I try listen as much as engineer and (dare I say it?) producer as I do as a musician. Certain things that make sense musically sometimes do not work in the overall context of the song and that's what a producer does - he steers the song towards a particular objective.

One other thing I forgot to mention is the occasional discordant note here and there - the final chord is a bit iffy, but could be described as "by choice", but there was another one I noticed at some point, somewhere in the low end (might be more obvious when the bass is brought up in the mix).

[deleted]

I can see how this would work well live. Reminds me of Rocky Horror Picture Show a bit. I see the "old and new" concept coming through, interesting approach and perhaps a new genre? I quite like that little 8th note pause, before you get into the phrase, but maybe you can get away with just doing a serious accent on the second 8th note.

I know diddly squat about mixing, but since I've become more aware of it I see how it's a whole art form on it's own. I've been listening through earphones and people get very creative, making sounds go in circles and such. I remember how listening to Nick Cave through earphones freaked me out a bit becuase a scream gradualy builds up out of nowhere and then you become aware of it all of a sudden. Or once Jimi Hendrix was whispering "Voodoo Chile" through one speaker while the rest of his singing came out of the other. Weird and Creepy.

All I can think of is that once you get more confidence with mixing you'll become more creative.

AlanRatcliffe

Viccy wrote: I've been listening through earphones and people get very creative, making sounds go in circles and such. I remember how listening to Nick Cave through earphones freaked me out a bit becuase a scream gradualy builds up out of nowhere and then you become aware of it all of a sudden. Or once Jimi Hendrix was whispering "Voodoo Chile" through one speaker while the rest of his singing came out of the other. Weird and Creepy.

Careful - you'll end up like me... listening to Pink Floyd's The Wall for years with headphones, making notes in a little notebook on all the details and how they might have achieved them. Uncovering the "secret message", knowing "where they came in" and all the other little details. Floyd can drive you mad with all the detail in the later albums, not only is it very well recorded (understatement of the year), but the attention to detail with how sounds (both musical and "atmospherics") fit together to form a cohesive whole is amazing.

All I can think of is that once you get more confidence with mixing you'll become more creative.

I tend to think most people get set in their ways and experiment less. They find a few "tricks" that work and repeat them. Kind of like most guitarists. ?

[deleted]

Okay insomnia has set in. I've been thinking about what didn't fit well when I first heard the song. It was the singer's voice. Stunning as it is, it needs to resonate with the rest of the band's sound. Something needs to balance and support it. Just a hint in the guitar or something, like a smoother sound here or there. Also, was thinking,instead of a strong accent on the 8th note, why don't you just add it on to the second beat of the bar, like a crunched note.

I tend to think most people get set in their ways and experiment less. They find a few "tricks" that work and repeat them. Kind of like most guitarists. Smiley

Hey, we're all just dying slowly anyway.

DonovanB

Norio wrote: Wow, Alan! "All I can think of for now" ?!?! You're amazing dude. You should consider charging for this sort of advice.

Eg: FixMySong.co.za - People upload and then pay R50-R300 for the critique. Could work ya know? ?

someone tried that. I didn't know who he was and i didn't bother investigating further. I reckon this forum is a good place because you're not tying down to one opinion. You can identify whether someone has a preference for certain genre's so to take their words from whence they come.

In essence this is good for a demo. I believe that a band needs to record a song at least 3 times over to sort out the arrangements, placement of the instruments (and sounds) in the mix and tones of the instruments. Too many bands try get it right the first time and for me, and I consider myself mediocre at best, I'm not good enough to get it dead right the first time. The only time I've ever heard someone doing that was the solo for Unforgiven on Metallica's black album.