Where can I study to become a music producer

tubby · 2009-04-02T14:42:35+00:00

Well as the subject says, where can i study to become a producer. I am already producing some wicked stuff using cubaseSX, but where can i get some documenta...

Where can I study to become a music producer

Neps

The truth of the matter is that no education will get you into the 'music producing' sector.. A lot of the guys who produce either were engineers or were very lucky to get the gig. The music industry is very diffrent from others.. Dean was right in his analogy of the heart transplant.

Yes, I did study.. Yes, I am in the process of getting my advanced ProTools qualification (but that is so that I can actualy figure out what 'DAE error 1093' stands for.. :-[ But as for producing.. Well I get the gigs because of reputation.. And then it's not just producing but also engineering. In SA you have to wear both hats most of the times.

There are quite a few places that I will NEVER recommend. (wont name names, but 2 of them are eithr distance based or has distance based cirriculums) The other has quite a few members on this forum.. :-\

The one I will mention to consider is in JHB. Based at Henley and isn't too bad. Doing my PT qualifications through them. ONLY PT certified place in SA. And NO, there is no such place in CT, even if one of them went public to say they are.. They just own PT rigs but no certification.

majestikc

If you've already produced some wicked stuff then surely that's worth more than a piece of paper, why don't you use your actual production skills in some kind of demo to get a foot in the door.

Doesn't that work better?

tubby

Thanx chaps for the feed back. A lot of valid points!!!

majestikc wrote: If you've already produced some wicked stuff then surely that's worth more than a piece of paper, why don't you use your actual production skills in some kind of demo to get a foot in the door.

Doesn't that work better?

Ill take you up on that challenge. Im already working on an album, with two completed tracks so far.

majestikc

That seems like the most reasonable thing to do, then when it's done you can drop it off at as many people as possible and whip up a myspace with the best tracks and email as many people that it would apply to so they can take a listen etc.

If it's good enough they might get back to you.........if it's TOO good they might NOT ? (there doesn't seem to be enough to go around and share)

matta

Tubby and others,

Let me tell you, as a commercial studio owner, who has worked in the industry for over 12 years... papers/qualifications mean nothing... I only care about your show reel/experience.

Save your money and develop these skills... seriously, educational institutes are only as good as their staff (and what they are willing to pay... and it ain't much...) and sadly many of the staff at most of these colleges have NEVER run/owned a commercial studio, many of the lecturers are just graduates from the year before.... how will they EVER prepare you for a real world session?

I've worked in studios the world over, am colleagues/friends with some of the biggest names in the industry... none of whom ever went to 'college' and needed a piece of paper... we all learn the same way... internship and practical experience.

Right now I'll be honest it is the WORST time to be trying to get into the game, esp. if you want to make music rather than a corporate gig... many studios have closed down and there are fewer and fewer jobs, yet more and more graduates. It is global thing, not indicative of only SA... I'm actually going to be closing my studio doors later this year and move into a new home studio, it is far more cost effective/productive esp. in today's music and economic climate.

I was chatting to a well known engineer and mentor of mine when I was in New Orleans last year and he said "The crux is we need to make better records faster".... Sadly I WISH it were like the glory days when people cared about quality gear, budgets, art etc... long gone I'm afraid.

I've just worked with the writers from the show "American Idol" and they couldn't BELIEVE how cheap my studio was considering my gear list.... my vintage Neumann U67 (a R60,000 valve mic) costs them as much per day in the USA as it did my whole studio and me for 8 hours... yet I STRUGGLE to get local artists to see the value in GREAT gear... it has made me realize I just can't keep up in an SA climate and would rather scale down and work from home and rent a studio for a day or 5 a month for serious tracking and do the rest at home.

Even the commercial post guys are struggling, I pooled a couple friends at some of the biggest post houses and turnover is down as much as 40-60% from last year this time... the credit crunch is hitting us hard.

Sorry for the doom and gloom, just sharing the grim reality, I think there is hope, but the key word is... adaptability...

Cheers

Matt

Guy-Onraet

matta wrote: Tubby and others,

Let me tell you, as a commercial studio owner, who has worked in the industry for over 12 years... papers/qualifications mean nothing... I only care about your show reel/experience.

Save you money and develop these skills... seriously, educational institutes are only as good as their staff (and what they are willing to pay... and it ain't much...) and sadly many of the staff at most of these colleges have NEVER run/owned a commercial studio, many of the lecturers are just graduates from the year before.... how will they EVER prepare you for a real world session?

I've worked in studios the world over, am colleagues/friends with some of the biggest names in the industry... none of whom ever went to 'college' and needed a piece of paper... we all learn the same way... internship and practical experience.

Right now I'll be honest it is the WORST time to be trying to get into the game, esp. if you want to make music rather than a corporate gig... many studios have closed down and there are fewer and fewer jobs, yet more and more graduates. It is global thing, not indicative of only SA... I'm actually going to be closing my studio doors later this year and move into a new home studio, it is far more cost effective/productive esp. in today's music and economic climate.

I was chatting to a well known engineer and mentor of mine when I was in New Orleans last year and he said "The crux is we need to make better records faster".... Sadly I WISH it were like the glory days when people cared about quality gear, budgets, art etc... long gone I'm afraid.

I've just worked with the writers from the show "American Idol" and they couldn't BELIEVE how cheap my studio was considering my gear list.... my vintage Neumann U67 (a R60,000 valve mic) costs them as much per day in the USA as it did my whole studio and me for 8 hours... yet I STRUGGLE to get local artists to see the value in GREAT gear... it has made me realize I just can't keep up in an SA climate and would rather scale down and work from home and rent a studio for a day or 5 a month for serious tracking and do the rest at home.

Even the commercial post guys are struggling, I pooled a couple friends at some of the biggest post houses and turnover is down as much as 40-60% form last year this time... the credit crunch is hitting us hard.

Sorry for the doom and gloom, just sharing the grim reality, I think there is hope, but the key word is... adaptability...

Cheers

Matt

Great post Matt, and good to see you here.

matta

Guy Onraet wrote:Great post Matt, and good to see you here.

Hey Guy,

Good to see you here as well! How is your modded MT-2 working out for you? Enjoying the new EQ settings? I'm about to drop a wad of cash on some NOS Germanium Diodes so should be able to offer the Tri/Dual Gain mod soon as well.

Cheers

Matt

tubby

matta wrote:
Sorry for the doom and gloom, just sharing the grim reality, I think there is hope, but the key word is... adaptability...

Hey MAtt thanx for your brilliant post. I Agree with you it definitely has to do with adaptability and some quality geer. Every piece of new geer i buy seems to improve the quality of my production. BUT, with the quality of some of the software applications ive come across in the past couple months i definitely think that the time of the big recording studios are numbered. Gone are the days where you need thousands of rand worth of equipment. A well known member on this forum, Andrew Bryson, produces pretty much industry standard quality with a Boss GT8 and A Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic plugged directly into his PC (And obviously using one of his many awesome, modded guitars). I myself am producing nearly the same quality (with less guitaring skills and overall talent than MR Bryson of course) with my Fender Strat, a Behringer Tube preamp and a roland cube 30 watt.

Im not saying that software beets the real thing but it does come damn close. And the key here is adaptability. Small home studios, can, with cheaper gear and some good software, do a damn good job for a put load less money.

Thanx for your post MATT it has made me realize a few important aspects of the music and the education industries. Its time for me to put put my ass in gear and get my name out there.

matta

Tubby wrote: Hey MAtt thanx for your brilliant post. I Agree with you it definitely has to do with adaptability and some quality geer. Every piece of new geer i buy seems to improve the quality of my production. BUT, with the quality of some of the software applications ive come across in the past couple months i definitely think that the time of the big recording studios are numbered. Gone are the days where you need thousands of rand worth of equipment. A well known member on this forum, Andrew Bryson, produces pretty much industry standard quality with a Boss GT8 and A Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic plugged directly into his PC (And obviously using one of his many awesome, modded guitars). I myself am producing nearly the same quality (with less guitaring skills and overall talent than MR Bryson of course) with my Fender Strat, a Behringer Tube preamp and a roland cube 30 watt.

Im not saying that software beets the real thing but it does come damn close. And the key here is adaptability. Small home studios, can, with cheaper gear and some good software, do a damn good job for a put load less money.

Thanx for your post MATT it has made me realize a few important aspects of the music and the education industries. Its time for me to put put my ass in gear and get my name out there.

Glad I could be of help. I think the days of studios being numbered is not just because the tools are easier to access (and sounding better and better), but just the state of music in general... the power is shifting to the artist, not the labels and new forms of distribution are leading to artists finding inventive ways to make and sell their music.

I still feel that you can replace the studio, but not the engineer... much the same way as giving a strat to a kid who can't play a note makes him a guitarist, and these engineering skills are learned over long periods of time.

I also think BIG studios will always exist, and I for one HOPE they do. I'd just rather not own one as much of the work CAN and IS done in home/project studios, but I'd still prefer to record drums in a great sounding live room than say my kitchen or livingroom (hey it has worked in the past, but still...), but would rather do my pre production on my own time and then book a few days in studio when needed.

RE gear, ALWAYS buy the BEST you can, even if it means holding off for the now... I have LOST so much money in buying 'in between' gear, trying to resell it gives you little to no return on your investment.

Just keep at it and the more you work on it, the better you will get... in this game practice really does make perfect.

Cheers

Matt

Guy-Onraet

Sucks that you are closing Dockyard Matt, that place is too cool. That modded pedal is completely different to the original. It's being worked hard and is already all over my album. Not sure i even need those diodes for my purposes, but i'll call you and we can chat more about it then.

thunderbolt

Sadly what Matt is saying is true.

On learning producing.... best way as suggested earlier is to job shadow with current producers in our country and to listen to music and the elements in music.

How does the guitar sound, how does the drums sound to you, where does the vocals sit, in what context is the band playing, what feeling do you get when you listen to a specific song? All questions that you have to consult when you're listening to britney spears or to Opeth. Does that sound translate?

And then asking yourself and the band/artist. What sound will suit the genre that you are looking at producing and what you can add or take away to make the music exceptional for the target market that they are aiming for.

I hear so many bands that want to go for the 'live sounding' feel on their record and they run to studio and record it in a week, mix it in a week and have it mastered locally and it doesn't sound like 'seether', because they have not done their homework and because Seether's records were produced by Howard Benson, Mixed by Chris Lord Alge and mastered by Tom Baker, 3 HUUUUGE names in the American industry, who all charge accordingly to their talent (a whole lot of money, maybe even as much as the average house X 2 in south africa... for the entire record). This being said, A producers role, in my honest opinion is to know which studios to track at, putting together a business plan for the band regarding the recording process, a time schedule and going into the band/artists practises and knowing what they want, what you(the producer) expects from them and being well versed in their material. Even a preproduction could be done at home and presented to you(the producer) to listen to and to brainstorm how you will make the artist/band's record sound much better than it currently does. Getting the right mix engineer, getting the right mastering engineer and what record label to present it to, IF the band wants to be signed and not stay independent.

the producer's role(in my opinion) is to know music, from the engineering and mixing aspect, to the songwriting process, what the artist wants, what the artist needs to get the result they want as well as the business side of things(when it comes to WHO you are going to use to make your bands product sound like they want it to).