Neck Pup in Bridge position - Bridge pup in Neck position?

Skylark

What's the implications of having the Neck Pup in Bridge position and Bridge pup in Neck position?

The incompetent dimwit that I paid to fit the pups did it that way and also switched the pots around Logs on vol and linear on tone(which means tone control only worked between 1 and 3 position), switched the pots around only to find after doing the fiddly wiring work that the pups are in the wrong position as well...

Sounds great as is though, not planning on swopping them just wondering how this works out. I always thought the bridge was wound a fair bit hotter than the neck pup?

The pups are Tonerider Rocksongs in a hollow body, they sound balanced as they are, neck is nice and slightly woolly and the bridge is more cutting.

V8

I'll start the discussion...but hopefully the many more experienced and knowledgeable fellows around here will chime in and correct my layperson ramblings... :-[

I've tried a tonerider generator neck in the bridge a coupla times - it works quite well (imho). To my untrained ears, it lends it self towards a vintage rock feel/sound. From my handful of experiments, typically where a pickup is, colours the sound as bridge/neck more than if it is a neck/bridge pickup.

What I noticed what to balance the output of the two neck generators in the neck & bridge was the neck pup was a bit lower and the bridge a bit higher than I'd have expected. Still got a surprising amount of squeal from the 7.9k generator neck in the bridge, but the 16.7k bridge one really screamed (no surprises there!).

From what I've read, back in the day pickup manufacturers didn't expressly make separate neck and bridge pups (I'm thinking that came around the time players wanted high gain shreddy tones?). E.g. I checked out a late 70's westbury and those DiMarzio's (super distortion in bridge & PAF in neck) were not specifically for bridge and neck - they were used in the bridge and neck as the tonal characteristics of those pups suited that config. Also was messing around with a PRS that had a bare knuckle mule (neck) in the neck and a Suhr SSV (neck) in the bridge. This really worked in a classic rock tone (and clean tones), we swopped them around a few times, tried out generators as well - we all preferred the starting config of mule in neck and suhr in bridge. The pups just worked in the config.

There's a bit of an opinion out there that "there's no wrong or right - experiment and see what works for you".

The one exception I can think of is F-spaced pickups (3mm wider), which usually are for the bridge pos - but according to the DiMarzio FAQ - not exclusively.

chris77

Sounds eerily similar to an experience I had! ? Some time ago I took my Ibanez AJD 91c (semi-hollow) in to a store to have a set of Tonerider Rocksongs fitted as well. This dude didn't swop the pups around, but managed to fit them upside down. He did however flip the switch (bridge pup selected in neck position and neck pup selected in bridge position) and also switched the pickup surrounds - bridge surround on neck pup and neck surround on the birdge pup. Then as a cherry on the cake he also somehow managed to wire the tone pot in reverse , so that physically turning it up actually turned it down and vice versa. Man, wonder what it is about Semi-hollows and Rocksongs which confuses these okes so much.. :-[

AlanRatcliffe

I know guys who like the hotter, warmer bridge pickup in the neck and the neck in the bridge, but they are few and far between (usually guys that gigged a vintage instrument for years that happened to be similar). You can balance the levels in most combos as long as you don't mind the bridge being cranked real close to the strings and the neck backed way off.

Makes for the widest tonal range, but it's usually a bit too big a difference for most folk by the time you've got the balance sorted - the bridge will be too bright and strident and the neck too fat and woolly. Tune the amp for one and the other is too extreme.

So yeah - if you like it, fine, but otherwise take it back and get the guy to sort out his mess.

peterleroux

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: Makes for the widest tonal range, but it's usually a bit too big a difference for most folk by the time you've got the balance sorted - the bridge will be too bright and strident and the neck too fat and woolly.

i.e converts your double humbucker guitar into a Tele :?

It's worth learning how to solder so that you're not at the mercy of the 'guy at the shop'

beardedmoose

Before 83 i think there was no such thing as bridge and neck pups. there were only pups. sooo modern pickups have more resistance on the neck than the bridge if i am correct. you can either take it back or you can play around with your pickup heights. I have two "neck" position tonerider generators in my jagmaster and its fantastic. so ... the end of my story, you can pretty much do whatever you wanna do with em as long as it sounds sweet.

Hope it helps

Skylark

Thanks for the replies, how accurately do the pole magnets need to be below the string, the twit(now moved to the uk so no taking it back) also mounted the bridge pup a mm or 2 to the left so only the very edge of the high e pole is below the high e string.

As I said before the guitar sounds great as it is, just interested to know how these issues will influence the tone, it was an amazing guitar before this guy got hold of it so apart from the cosmetics /wiring etc that the guy stuffed up the basic guitar is still amazing.

beardedmoose

Skylark wrote: Thanks for the replies, how accurately do the pole magnets need to be below the string, the twit(now moved to the uk so no taking it back) also mounted the bridge pup a mm or 2 to the left so only the very edge of the high e pole is below the high e string.

As I said before the guitar sounds great as it is, just interested to know how these issues will influence the tone, it was an amazing guitar before this guy got hold of it so apart from the cosmetics /wiring etc that the guy stuffed up the basic guitar is still amazing.

set your amp on clean and at a decent volume, then start adjsuting the pickup heights. if its too high you will hear overtones.. so lower it until the overtones are gone and there you have it. that mm the pole piece is out wont make much of a difference.

Good luck dude :goodtimes:

AlanRatcliffe

That can also be down to the bridge and neck pickups being reversed - modern sets often have a wider polepiece spacing on the bridge position.

Generally, the problem with misaligned polepieces is more cosmetic than audible. The magnetic field from each pole is fairly wide in most designs. So it is rarely a real problem. Note that some modern designs do have either low gauss magnets (noiseless, Low-Z actives) or very narrow magnetic apertures (Lace Sensors), and these pickups can be a lot more sensitive to pickup height and misalignment (both for tonality and volume).

The inverse square rule also applies to the magnet/pickup's distance from the string, so it is far more sensitive to polepiece position when the pickup is set very close to the strings. Further away and the lateral displacement of an offset pole becomes a minor/insignificant factor. So if you do find you have a set of pickups that has a quiet outside string or is unbalanced from string to string (vintage staggered single-coils), try lowering the pickups to even out the difference.