Quality Machine heads/ nylon setup

DrGonzo

Hi guys

So i have a nice sounding Nylon and all but recently decided not so nice playing. the action is a little high and the tuning pegs/machine heads are I reckon pretty shit... Like I have to turn more than im used to to get it to work?
Intonation is alright maybe not perfect but havent noticed anything specifically wrong.

So instead of floggin it like i would usually do at the first sign of snobby dissatisfaction I think I want to work on it a bit.

How much difference will better quality machine heads make do you think??
and if so - What represents a good Tuning head that I should look out for - Brand? Shop in Cape Town??

What else would you recommend I do? maybe just sand down the bridge a little bit to get the strings lower... It doesnt look like there is an accessible truss rod to play with in any case so not much i can do there in terms of neck angle.

Help and advice always welcome and highly regarded ? ?

Shibbibilybob

Looking at this: https://www.lmii.com/products/mostly-not-wood/tuning-machines/classical-guitar-tuners
It seems a lot of classical tuners are a whole lot more expensive than high quality steel string tuners (Gotoh 510s will usually be under 100USD).
Looking at that list, I would take the SChallers with the ebony buttons ?

If you're interested, I am in Cape town and will be doing an Lmi order in the next month or two. If you don't find anything locally and are willing to wait.

AlanRatcliffe

Oh hell, yeah - it's possible to spend up to $1,500 on some of the better classical tuners... ?

The Schallers are pretty good - I have a set of the Hauser style on my Carvin. Only decent tuners in the sub $100 price range.

Next step up would be the Gotoh Premium (not standard) range. However, the Sloanes (only from Stewmac) are in the same price range as the Gototoh premiums, but actually better tuners.

From there it starts getting silly - Alessi, Graf, Gilbert, Rodgers, Scheller, Rubner, etc. - all precision handmade jobs by artisan engineers ...and priced as such. Basically buy once and forget about them for the rest of the guitar's life.

What is the guitar, BTW? any pics? If it's a good guitar, it is better to have the neck reset than the bridge shaved. How much meat is left on the saddle (although shaving the saddle does affect the tone if you take it low)?

DrGonzo

Alan,

its a Miguel Almeria Classical.. bought at Music Woodmead in PTA... its pretty decent. cost me about R3600 if memory serves... so its by no means a high end classical and at the same time its not an egg either.

Ill upload pics in a bit.

So ja not sure if it is worth getting new tuners if they are so expensive??? I mean how much difference is it going to make?
I mentioned I dont have much tuning issues ( ok maybe slight battle with the g-string sometimes - you all know that slippery fella ? )... its just sometimes have to turn the heads a bit more than i would normally to get it to tune. weird but not much of a hinderance in my life.

With regards to the action. I genuinely would not know how to reset the neck. the neck is solid on the body and there is no truss rud visable from either end.

AlanRatcliffe

While tuners are about the only mod you can do to a nylon, it never makes sense to spend more on tuners than you did on the guitar. ?

If you're used to steel strings or electric, then tuning a classical is a lot of turning as the strings stretch a lot more, a peg winder is a must for fitting strings. And yeah, the G is the worst. The way you tie the strings on (on both ends) makes a big difference to the tuning stability, and it's something that it's really worth paying attention to.

Classical guitars do not usually have truss rods as there is a relatively low tension on the neck. Before you do anything radical, see how much meat is on the saddle. If it can be lowered, that's the first option. If it's already low there's not much to be done - shaving the bridge doesn't work well as there is no way to increase the break angle over the saddle. A neck reset (where the neck is removed and reattached at more of an angle) is a pro - and expensive - job, only really worth it on the better instruments.

Bob-Dubery

zohn wrote: Playing action at the nut makes a big difference for playability and is one aspect guitar makers (even custom and hand builders) overlook. Check the distance between the crown of the first fret and the bottom of the string(s). You can have the slots taken down untill that dimension is around 0.35mm. (do the measurement with an automotive feeler gauge +- R25.00)

+1

A good rough test for this is to capo at the first fret. If life suddenly gets a whole lot easier then probably the nut is too high.

DrGonzo

This is some great info thanks guys...

Ja i decided im not gonna change the machine heads, its a bit overkill. As i said its not like its a rare vintage hand made classical. its a nice guit and sounds nice but u know, its nothing special.

X-rated Bob wrote:
zohn wrote: Playing action at the nut makes a big difference for playability and is one aspect guitar makers (even custom and hand builders) overlook. Check the distance between the crown of the first fret and the bottom of the string(s). You can have the slots taken down untill that dimension is around 0.35mm. (do the measurement with an automotive feeler gauge +- R25.00)
+1

A good rough test for this is to capo at the first fret. If life suddenly gets a whole lot easier then probably the nut is too high.

Cool Bob thanks Im gonna give that a try.

zohn wrote: If the guitar is relatively new (which I guess it is) there shouldn't be a problem with the neck angle. If there is then I suggest you sell it because classical necks are very expensive to reset - they (the more serious models) are constructed with Spanish heel-neck joints, which basically means the guitar body is glued-in with the neck and can't be removed like a normal dove-tail or bolt-on joint.

there is no problem with the neck and nope definately not in the mood to take her apart!

I will check out the saddle and nut and maybe i can do a quick fix, clean and restring and she be playing beatifully im sure.