Wormwood
my first guitar was a Hondo, a black and white strat copy with a birds eye maple neck.
I learned how to play electric guitar on it (this is important, acoustic is another animal entirely with its own skills and feel) , I learned about bands, fans, how irritating a G string is and ( thanks to the rather wild interpretation of the fender headstock, what it was like to drive your guitar forcefully into your bassists ribs.
I received a lot of flack for having a HONDA from my drummer, but it was imperative we keep him (also he was a natural musician and a pianist who would sight read Handel for fun, like you and I would a book and at the same time have 4 girlfriends at once...drummers). So along with the 1 castle quart and a packet of camel filters every practice it was tolerated...unlike the tone deaf bassist.
During my time at "Natal Tecknikon light jazz fool around club" it served me well and all I could dream of to replace it was a MIA black strat.
When it my grandmother gave me some money , however I bought a bike, as I had started to jog from near Entabeni hospital to City campus every morning cause I was always late for the bus and it was getting a bit much.
Anyway I had to sell that guitar to " defray expenses" but that is besides the point.
When I hit Dubai, the 1st thing I bought was a mattress and right next door, another Hondo strat, black, twisted maple neck, with a sticker that repeated ALICE MACHINE GUN ELEPHANT on it from black to grey. clearly Japanese and apparently a relatively famous band.
this guitar sucked BALLS.
During this time I dreamed of a Gibson Les Paul. ( actually I always had, but they were a thing of legend and myth, purchase wise). They were played by my heroes and I dreamed of a particular sound that the strat wouldn't provide no matter how close.
Not long after that I saw an advert: Gbson les paul studio, SD jeff beck and '59, spergel tuners, strap locks and so on.
Im not going to go into how weird the guy was that sold it to me, or how incredibly Tatooine his flats were, how I almost died getting back or how difficult it was to find or how he hounded me for 6 months to join his band who's lyrics dealt specifically with his incredible lust for Asian women. Point is I had a freaking les paul.
And i was dissapointed.
I mean the quality was unmistakable, the sound was piano like (unlpugged) this was clearly something ina different league but it seemed to do a particular sound and it was dark. where was the glass? why do i have to play on the bridge all the time, where are those harmonics?
fast track to recently: where I bought a Russian Big Muff.
It is the sound i have been looking for forever. The earliest album i listened to was Animals for bog sakes, then cream and so on.
It is easily the most transparent distortion ever and brings the growl i thought only achievable with humbuckers and mahogany.
So what do i do now. Clearly im regretting not buying the Eric Clapton Signature I saw on Dubizzle ( Dubai gumtree) for the same price.
Hell even financially they command oodles of moolah more than my studio in south africa. so that i sout of the picture ( seriously i was looking at the equivalent of 12 grand for a near to new one).
Im writing this so that people can understand that a Gibson, despite it marketing and mistique, might not be the sound you were chasing adn also perhaps that in this ever tightening funnel of today's economic times, perhaps it is maybe even ethically responsible that we reduce our wants into needs and have only one of a particular thing, its best to really do your research, physically before an emotionally driven purchase.
Maybe another reason im writing this is that perhaps there is someone out there who has made a similar but opposide mistake and woudl like to perhaps entertain the notion of a trade.
Im not sure yet. What do you guys think.
it is the ever strat vs les paul debate. I was pretty sure where I lay, but now?
coynegfsa
I mean the quality was unmistakable, the sound was piano like (unlpugged) this was clearly something ina different league but it seemed to do a particular sound and it was dark. where was the glass? why do i have to play on the bridge all the time, where are those harmonics?
You don't mention what amp you were playing it through at the time, it makes a huge difference. You don't quite mention what sound you're going for either. Keep in mind a cheap guitar can sound good if played through a good amp, but a good guitar played through a cheap amp can sound like crap.
Im writing this so that people can understand that a Gibson, despite it marketing and mistique, might not be the sound you were chasing adn also perhaps that in this ever tightening funnel of today's economic times, perhaps it is maybe even ethically responsible that we reduce our wants into needs and have only one of a particular thing, its best to really do your research, physically before an emotionally driven purchase.
Or you're writing this only because you bought a Gibson and you're not happy with it. Doesn't mean everyone will feel like that. I know of a few people who are really happy with their Gibson Studios / Tokais / Strats / eye-gougers, tastes differ widely. Some guitars work for some people and some guitars don't. I agree with you though as far as research goes. The only suggestion I really have is to go back and do yours from scratch. Dig up a bunch of records, pay attention to the guitar tone, make a list if you have to. Then go off to a music store and pair up different guitars with different amps to see what works for you.
Maybe an H-S-S Strat is really what you're looking for?
ezietsman
Hmmm, I don't think I can help much here. Maybe you just miss the glassiness of single coils. However, one thing to check first, I would think, is the insides of your LP. Gibson, for some or other reason decided that the USA models get 300k volume (and maybe tone) pots. It wasn't always like this and I'm not sure if the new ones has 300k pots anymore. This will kill off the treble by a great deal. So maybe, maybe fitting a set of decent 500k pots into your guitar will help you get the brightness you seek.
Coyne is correct too, some amps are darker than others, the amp and the amp's speaker will have a massive influence, although changing an amp is a great deal more effort than changing pots or even pickups.
Maybe you should compare your LP with some others you can find in and around Cape Town and through other amps, it will give you an idea whether it is just yours that you are not happy with.
Just a few thoughts...
domhatch
so, to summarise - and please correct me if i'm wrong:
- you started off with a strat copy hondo which you sold
- your next guitar was, essentially, the same beast
- but then you purchased your dream - a gibson jeff beck signature - and you are dazed and confused, despite the addition of the muff.
that about it?
see, here's the thing. what you are after is your Ultimate Tone. (ask anyone here. i don't use caps very often.)
Ultimate Tone is a Very Big Thing. most of us spend our lives, and vast tracts of money, in search of this elusive abstract. you hear something in your head. you see a hero on stage with a particular rig and try to replicate it.
yet, still! your tone, your sound, it differs! how can this be?
well, despite the protestations of one scott grove, every guitar is, indeed, a slightly different beast. storage, playing style of the owner, pickups, pots, wiring, attack of the clones - sorry - pick or whether indeed a pick is used at all, any number of factors impact the difference between the sound in your head, the sound your hear on stage or on a recording, and the one you make. and we haven't even got to amps yet.
so, to cut back into the discussion at hand. it's possible you got a dud. a mate of mine picked up a silverburst les paul second hand. beautiful thing. but plug it in, and man. suck city central. if you didn't pick up a dud, and the guitar is perfect in every way, then perhaps a les paul is not in your stars and, given your enjoyment of the first hondo, and the fact that you picked up another - again, despite the ball-sucking - perhaps we should consider ourselves a strat man.
i had a strat. highway one. beautiful instrument. cheap as chips compared to other mia strats, and marvellous build quality. but i just couldn't come to terms with the thing. the middle pup is right where i interact with the body most - if i give the strings a really good whack, it's right there. otherwise, the guitar was perfect. awesome one-piece maple neck, like satin to play, actually sold it to a forum member, who cherishes the thing now. i hope. or i'll find out and track him down.
were i you, mr wood, i would go shopping. you don't have to buy. but you can try. and try. and try... it's real, real fun.
dh
AlanRatcliffe
Yeah, been there many, many, many times. We all search for the perfect "one", but the sound in our head isn't always what we think it is. Also - as I guess happened with you - the ones we own along the way influence our tastes as we learn to play on them. Until you finally get your "dream" guitar and find your dream has changed to something else while you weren't looking.
First I wanted to be Ace Frehley (KISS) :-[, so naturally my mother bought me a Yamaha nylon and sent me to classical lessons. ☹ Lasted two lessons and the guitar stood unplayed for a year or so until a hostel friend taught me a few songs. The fingerstyle thing sticks with me to this day.
I still had the rock bug, and lusted over Fender catalogues (as Knopfler said: "I knew what Fender catalogues smelled like"). So I got a part-time job and bought my first "real guitar" - a top of the line Fender "The Strat". But it was an absolute dog and put me off Fender for years. Sold it after three months. Never stopped chasing the Strat "quack" and neck tones though...
Then switched to a neck-through 'bucker guitar (the Sanox in my avatar - the first guitar that I played and just had to own) and played that exclusively for 15 years, just modding it whenever my tastes changed. But ultimately, no single guitar does everything (though it got close).
Eventually I went back to a Strat, but built my own. These days I'm equally divided between that and a nylon (my mother would be proud ?), but still reach for a humbucker guitar on occasion for those things that only they can do.
domhatch
hey! i just realised what the solution to your problem could be. either, as coyne suggested, an h-s-s strat or, the best of both worlds - a p-90 paul! a nice, fat, single coil!
i've loved p-90s since, like, forever. so when you're out looking and trying, be sure to add something with p-90s to your list. like a tokai ls-95s.
good luck
dh
shaundtsl
My experience was similar, I have always loved a les paul guitar and wanted one for years.
I had a few strat copies over the years and I guess they did what they were supposed to and when I had the funds available I bought a les paul and I didn't even consider anything else, I wanted a les paul.
OK, so it was an epiphone les paul standard, but it was one of those good quality nicer ones which I thought it was cool, maybe it cant be compared to a proper Gibson or the Tokais, so maybe I haven't tried all my Les Paul options.
But it was only when I bought my current strat that I really felt I have a guitar which works with me, I almost couldn't believe what I was missing and to be honest with you, I actually miss my Ibanez 7 string more than my les paul, but that's just me and my preferences and maybe the place I am at in my life right now.
I dunno, I enjoyed the les paul, but for me it doesn't compare to my strat.
I think its more about it being the right guitar for me.
Wormwood
I got so incredibly busy since i posted this, it looks like there are genuine and informative answers.
tonight is going to be a 3 o clocker, im going to have to check in later.
Wormwood
Thanks for all the feedback.
I think at the end of the day I have realised I am a Strat man, and want a good Strat
What I'm not going to do is get rid of the Gibson though, it took long enough to get it and it is by no means a rubbish instrument.
So, 500k pots: thanks EZ been thinking about that for a while.
buy cheaper strat, shove in some decent pups and block up the trem.
viola.
One day perhaps I can get a decent USA strat for that silky single coil sound. I just wish pick-ups could be hot swapped quickly so I can put in p90's for different songs. I wonder if that could be done somehow....
domhatch
Wormwood wrote:
Thanks for all the feedback.
I think at the end of the day I have realised I am a Strat man, and want a good Strat
What I'm not going to do is get rid of the Gibson though, it took long enough to get it and it is by no means a rubbish instrument.
So, 500k pots: thanks EZ been thinking about that for a while.
buy cheaper strat, shove in some decent pups and block up the trem.
viola.
One day perhaps I can get a decent USA strat for that silky single coil sound. I just wish pick-ups could be hot swapped quickly so I can put in p90's for different songs. I wonder if that could be done somehow....
cheaper strat + decent usa strat = highway one. look for a good quality second-hand highway one and start there. if it's been well handled and wrangled, it'll be an awesome instrument to start on. and you will have oodles of cash left over to meddle with the pups and wotnot.
i blocked the trem on mine as well - not big on the old trems, me - and it held up like a trojan. great guitars. get a one piece maple neck though, don't like the rosewood fingerboard much m'self. maple feels smooth 'n silky - be a good match for your smooth 'n silky pups.
but i'd leave the viola for them as wants to play in the philharmonic... ?
dh
ps - let us know how that liberator works out!
AlanRatcliffe
Wormwood wrote:
I think at the end of the day I have realised I am a Strat man, and want a good Strat
We all grow up eventually. ?
What I'm not going to do is get rid of the Gibson though, it took long enough to get it and it is by no means a rubbish instrument.
Good. Chances are good you will regret it if you do. As EZ mentioned, there are ways and means to tweak them to taste (I'm busy going through it with my PRS Singlecut).
buy cheaper strat, shove in some decent pups and block up the trem.
Perfect. Just try lots of examples until you find one where you really like the feel and unplugged tone. Doesn't have to be an expansive one, but you do have a greater chance of finding a good'un quickly in the mid to upper price ranges. They are selling far below value ATM too (for proof just look at the Mexi in the classifieds or the EC sig on Gumtree.
No need to block the trem, just remove the arm, tighten the screws until the bridge sits flat on the body (or put in another two springs) and you're golden. I've always played Strats like that.
One day perhaps I can get a decent USA strat for that silky single coil sound. I just wish pick-ups could be hot swapped quickly so I can put in p90's for different songs. I wonder if that could be done somehow....
There are ways, but far more practical is the Clapton mid boost circuit, which lets you go from classic Strat to something a lot more Gibson-like with lots of mids - during performance too.
StefStoep
Don't know if you are currently looking for a Strat but check the classified section. Norman86 is selling his MIM Strat that has already had some mods done. Seems like it is quite a good deal to me, if i where looking for a Strat i would have given him a call already!
ps: i don't know Norman so i'm not marketing his "product", i just think it is a good deal.
Wormwood
Too soon unfortunately.
That does look like a very good deal too.
RJN
Wormwood . I found your post quite entertaining, thanks for that !
Through what amp are you playing your LP ?
Malkav
Just gouge your eyes out and get an Ibanez! ?
BMU
Chad Adam Browne wrote:
Just gouge your eyes out and get an Ibanez! ?
I can feel that. ?
I try to explain to people I don't have 10 guitars because I "collect" them. It's just a byproduct of the journey to figure out what I really wanted. Even though they're all 7 string shred machines. (Except of course the basses and a very ill conceived failed experiment of a PRS SE 6 string...still gotta give that to charity or something.)
Even in that narrow focus, there's a lot of choice: 25.5 or 26.5? Maple, ebony or rosewood? Mahogany, ash or basswood? Actives or passives? Fixed/Floyd? Fret size? Neck thickness?
Wormwood
RJN wrote:
Wormwood . I found your post quite entertaining, thanks for that !
Through what amp are you playing your LP ?
Thanks man, I find it helpful to laugh at my life rather than scrutinize it too closely.
Currently got a unmodded CUB12r.
With regard to Ibanez.. and I really mean no offence here, but they remind me of something a wizard might play..
Theyre like the anthropomorphisation of a doff '80s big hair chick with neon green leg warmers and leopard spandex.
"mine has 7 strings and lighning bolts, check out this legato!"
peedldeedledeedledeedledeedle weeeeOOOOOOOOOWWWWW *divebombs off the stage
Big-G
BMU wrote:
(Except of course the basses and a very ill conceived failed experiment of a PRS SE 6 string...still gotta give that to charity or something.)
Probably a discussion for another thread, but this sounds very interesting? Do you have a thread about what you did, and what happened? I'd be interested to know more about this? Project gone wrong?
Cheers
G!
domhatch
Big G wrote:
BMU wrote:
(Except of course the basses and a very ill conceived failed experiment of a PRS SE 6 string...still gotta give that to charity or something.)
Probably a discussion for another thread, but this sounds very interesting? Do you have a thread about what you did, and what happened? I'd be interested to know more about this? Project gone wrong?
Cheers
G!
yeah, thread hijack, absolutely, but i'd also love to know what went down here. heard very few folks give bad feedback on those se's.
and, in case you're seriously considering it, i'm currently in the process of registering as a charity... ?
dh
