Tone

nick

Reading TDPRI forum there was a posted 'Do unifinished guitars just sound better?'

I thought this post by builder Ron Kirn was quite interstesting.

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/4581512-post31.html

Sean

Ja, really interesting, thanks.

These made me laugh:

"cause... really . . the gear really doesn’t mean schidt.... if you can play ... and if ya cant. . . do you really think anyone else cares? "

and

"There’s never been a case that I have heard about where someone was listening to a horrible guitarist... went ‘n yanked that POS outta his hands, gave ‘im a wonderful sounding guitar, then stood there thinking... damn, that guitar pickin’ is just plain awful, but the tone is amazing...."

? ?

Keira-WitherKay

Such true words ........

About time some one started challenging the " advertising blurb" about tone that rules most peoples choices , forgetting that the people saying most of these things want you to buy their product or are from players trying to justify their choices ,

so yes the best and most tonefull gear , fun as it may be , means nothing unless you can play

i'm always amazed that players spend so much money on gear to find tone but so little on music lessons..... And yes a lotof tone comes from the player

i absolutely agree with the author , a bad player with top end gear is still a bad player:....... No matter how good the gear

And yes play the gear you like and forget what others say ..... Tone is personal , play what "floats your boat"

Bob-Dubery

Sean wrote: "There’s never been a case that I have heard about where someone was listening to a horrible guitarist... went ‘n yanked that POS outta his hands, gave ‘im a wonderful sounding guitar, then stood there thinking... damn, that guitar pickin’ is just plain awful, but the tone is amazing...."

My instinct is to say 'yes, but there have been cases where I've thought great playing, pity about the tone'. I paused for thought, and I think there are. Jerry Donohue with Joan Armatrading, for example - he plays really well, but that ultra trebly tone. Hmmmm.... And on several Richard Thompson tracks I can think of, most of them live, he has this really weird thing going on that makes his guitar sound flat (as in compressed and lacking dynamics, not as in out of tune) but that's more to do with something on his pedal board, I think. Sometimes when I've seen Tony Cox play he's had what sounds like a lot of clipping on his plugged in sound.

But the playing usually wins through. Keira is correct when she observes that a bum player with great gear is still a bum player, and the converse is true - a great player with not so good tone remains a great player.

Manfred-Klose

i've noticed this with my telecaster i built, not very common wood to use, but it has a nice chunky neck and it just makes the notes sing.

RJN

i don't know. I just enjoy myself so much more playing / practising on Decent Gear that sounds great , rather than playing on sub par gear.
I mean , have you ever played a guitar that felt like a stringed up cricket bat ? vs a guitar that sings out every single action you make on the neck.

Just my 2c , worth nothing.

Squonk

Sean wrote: "There’s never been a case that I have heard about where someone was listening to a horrible guitarist... went ‘n yanked that POS outta his hands, gave ‘im a wonderful sounding guitar, then stood there thinking... damn, that guitar pickin’ is just plain awful, but the tone is amazing...."
? ?

I always think to myself if Joe Satriani and Steve Vai had Fenders how awesome their tone would be ?

deefstes

Squonk wrote:
Sean wrote: "There’s never been a case that I have heard about where someone was listening to a horrible guitarist... went ‘n yanked that POS outta his hands, gave ‘im a wonderful sounding guitar, then stood there thinking... damn, that guitar pickin’ is just plain awful, but the tone is amazing...."
? ?
I always think to myself if Joe Satriani and Steve Vai had Fenders how awesome their tone would be ?

:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:

But then what would they use to gouge their eyes out?

AlanRatcliffe

Squonk wrote: I always think to myself if Joe Satriani and Steve Vai had Fenders how awesome their tone would be ?

Me too with Vai! Satch's tones aren't too bad though :-[

Gearhead

Keira WitherKay wrote: i absolutely agree with the author , a bad player with top end gear is still a bad player:....... No matter how good the gear

Just one point here: if it weren't for bad playing gear sluts like me, the good players would not have such great gear available at such nice prices as they do today. Only 1-2% of guitar gear buyers can play properly, so there would be no market without us mere mortals.

Norman86

Gearhead wrote:
Keira WitherKay wrote: i absolutely agree with the author , a bad player with top end gear is still a bad player:....... No matter how good the gear
Just one point here: if it weren't for bad playing gear sluts like me, the good players would not have such great gear available at such nice prices as they do today. Only 1-2% of guitar gear buyers can play properly, so there would be no market without us mere mortals.

+++++++++1..

i know, i fall into that category, even if gearhead doesnt!

i have great gear, it makes me feel good playing with it... but you'd think im much better than i am if you were to judge me on that alone! and be sorely mistaken!

Warren

So, yesterday a few forumites and I (and one ex-forumite) were having a little jam, just for fun.

The guitars we were playing:

Left to right:

Jap Strat (Foto-Flame), USA Strat, USA Strat, Peavey T-60, PRS Studio, Godin

In front:

USA Tele, PRS 22 (not sure of the model)

Amps we played through included:

Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, Peavey Classic 30, Mesa-Boogie Lone Star, Roland Cube 30x

I bring up all of this in this thread because, even though we had a pile of great guitars played through great amps through some great stomp-boxes, the Peavey T-60 through the Roland Cube produced some of the best tones of the day. Wonderful clean/grit tones that stood out from the "mix" really well, and in no way sounded at all inferior to the more expensive valve amps in the room. Could do some pretty cool metulhz as well, although I'm not very knowledgeable about such things. ?

The Peavey T-60 also sounded good because it was being played by Squonk, who likes to lie about not knowing how to play the guitar. He can play some fast little runs which are really clean and clear, and sounded awesome through the Cube.

Just goes to show that:

1) Tone is in both the fingers and the gear
2) The Roland Cube is a great-sounding piece of kit, and it doesn't need tubes to sound great

Fun! 8)

deefstes

Wow! Seems I REALLY missed out ☹

arjunmenon

Nice photo there Papa Smurf!
How is the owner of the foto-flame jap strat doing? Haven't heard from him in a while since he became a jet setter.

Cheers

Chabenda

Those T60's are great, sometimes the wood is as rough as a bear's proverbial (plenty of cracks to hold plectrums), heavier than a '70's Les Paul but incredibly versatile with unique tone.

Warren

Arjun Menon wrote: How is the owner of the foto-flame jap strat doing? Haven't heard from him in a while since he became a jet setter.

He is the proud owner of that Inca Silver Tele in the front, a recent acquisition. ? Doing quite well otherwise I believe, trying to convince him to swim Midmar next year ?

tiller

Didn't understood a thing out of that article. Humor is more than tips ?
But quite funny

funkadelic

Tone is everything. Of course you have to play properly as well to do the tone justice. I personally cannot stand a good guitarist with poor tone or a poor guitarist with good tone either. Both sucks in my opinion. But with tone being such a subjective thing who sucks depends on who's listening...

Keira-WitherKay

Problem with "tone" is it is all a perception in the head of the listener ..... And personal likes and dislikes come into it....

That expression " one mans meat is anothers poison" is very relevant

so i guess tone is ultimately personal ... So play what you enjoy and if other people love it good if not too bad .... Long as you happy

BluJu

One thing to add to the tone is also about the player argument.

It is not just about the skill of the player but the style too. Once you do have enough skill to say I have a specific style or tone of playing you need to match that with your gear.

Imagine SRV banging away on Yngwie Malmsteens strat with 8 guage strings? It would sound as as bad as malmsteen shredding away on BB King's ES 335.

All great players with all great gear but one these things must work hand in hand.

Your gear needs to suit your touch.