Home Recording

Badapple

So I will be looking at recording next year as I am starting to work and will have a bit of free cash.

I was wondering what I would need as a home setup (mics, programs, ect) as I will not be using the recordings professionally. I just want a good quality recording.

Also what would you guys recommend as a basic live performance setup?

Any online stores you would recommend?

Thanks!

:goodtimes:

Royce77

Badapple wrote: So I will be looking at recording next year as I am starting to work and will have a bit of free cash.

I was wondering what I would need as a home setup (mics, programs, ect) as I will not be using the recordings professionally. I just want a good quality recording.

Also what would you guys recommend as a basic live performance setup?

Any online stores you would recommend?

Thanks!

:goodtimes:

basically for a home set up you will need an audio box (to plug your mics or guitar into your computer), a condenser mic (make sure if you buy an audio box that it has phantom power/ 48v or else your condenser mic wont work ?)
most audio boxes come with software, im using studio one 2 at the moment and i love it .
you can also get some monitors or just use earphones if you cannot afford them (me :-[)

as far as a live performance set up goes, you will need your guitar, a few pedals ?, your amp and a shure sm57 (my choice) to mic up your amp.

Maybe try some of your locals stores, if you buy a whole bunch of items you might get a great discount from my experience ?

FruitarGeek

Go here: http://global.focusrite.com/usb-audio-interfaces/scarlett-2i4
This would be an excellent start, you won't get far without one of these, and this brand is the best bang for buck. Averages about R2000 per unit (maybe cheaper if you look hard enough on gumtree).
From that you can plug guitars and even mics straight into it, I hear the pre-amps are decent enough.

You will need a DAW, in which case I suggest you go for something free like Reaper. Then try find some free plugins. And you good to go.

When you start having more money, and more interest, but some mics, and buy some mic pre-amps.

AlanRatcliffe

Badapple wrote: I was wondering what I would need as a home setup (mics, programs, ect) as I will not be using the recordings professionally. I just want a good quality recording.

An interface for your PC, some recording software and at least one decent mic. Add a POD or other DI electric guitar solution and a drum machine then there shouldn't be anything stopping you.

As Royce said, many interfaces come with some kind of software - often a stripped-down version of a bigger package like Cakewalk, ProTools or Cubase. If that doesn't suit you (or the interface doesn't come with software), you can pick up Reaper for $50 (not free!), which is very nearly as capable as the big boys and very easy to use.

At the low end, I think condenser mics create more problems than they solve. I'm fast coming to the opinion that a decent dynamic mic (like an SM58 or SM57), coupled with a decent interface that has at least one good quality mic preamp is far more likely to give a good result in a modest setup than a cheap condenser.

Also what would you guys recommend as a basic live performance setup?

A small PA (either a powered mixer and passive speakers or mixer with powered speakers), mic and your guitars. A powered monitor will come in handy if you need to use a bigger PA (where feedback becomes more of a solution), but isn't essential with small systems, where you can just position the speakers so you can hear what's going on too. You can DI an acoustic with a pickup and use your electric guitar DI solution for DI-ing the electric.

You can also use a guitar amp, which can take a bit of strain off a small PA, but then it becomes more difficult to balance with the PA from both stage and audience perspective if you're doing the mixing from the stage. With a bigger PA, you'll need to mic up the amp, further increasing the complexity of the setup. BTW - A modelling amp's DI output lets you skip the need for a mic to add PA reinforcement and you can use the same output for recording.

Badapple

Ok doesn't sound too bad. I am noob though so be kind ?..

For recording could I then use:

The Focusrite Audio Interface that Adrian Rogowski (thanks) mentioned

Some recording program such as Reaper (will pay for it ?)

Drum machine

A mic (Shure SM57/58)

Monitors

Guitars (obviously)

For Live shows:

Small PA (thinking a powered mixer & passive speakers will work) - Could I use the monitor I use for recording?

Mic (same mic I use for the recording?)

Guitars (obviously)

Effects Pedal (something like a Boss GT-10)

Obviously good,durable and quality cables

Anything I am missing?

Also what would all this cost..? I know it cannot be accurate as prices differ everywhere, but what would be the worst possible damage to my pocket?

Shure SM58 mic: R1500 (http://www.soundz.co.za/pSHSM58LCE/Shure-SM58-Pro-Vocal-Microphone-SPECIAL.aspx)

Powered Mixer: R4000 (http://www.soundz.co.za/pBEPMP2000/Behringer-PMP2000-Powered-Mixer-with-Multi-FX-Processor.aspx)

Passive Speakers: R3590 (for two) (Gemini GT 1504 12")

Active Monitors: R2000 (http://www.soundz.co.za/pBEMS20/Behringer-MS20-Active-Budget-Monitor-Speaker-pair-SPECIAL.aspx]http://www.soundz.co.za/pBEMS20/Behringer-MS20-Active-Budget-Monitor-Speaker-pair-SPECIAL.aspx]http://www.soundz.co.za/pBEMS20/Behringer-MS20-Active-Budget-Monitor-Speaker-pair-SPECIAL.aspx)

Focusrite Audio Interface: +- R2000

Recording software & Drum machine: Price?

Boss Effects Pedal: R4000

TOTAL: R17 090 (Worst case I hope?? ?)

So there is my list with prices... What would yours be?? Hopefully less than mine lol

:goodtimes:

V8

Badapple wrote: So there is my list with prices... What would yours be?? Hopefully less than mine lol

Heya badapple,

I've been trying (with a low degree of success :-[) to combine a recording setup and a live performance setup. Asked a few questions here, ignored the sage advice of the experienced gfsa'ers (who've posted here as well). I did a quick write-up which (if you are interested) here : http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/the_guide_to/an_alternative_to_recording_guitar_based_material.html.

I'm still using it, and I'm working around the limitations - No FX loops for external pedals (grrr), a wobbly laptop (double grrrr) and a lack of patience (sigh). One thing I did learn, throwing $ at it didn't help - investing time & energy in figuring out what and how I wanted to do is helping somewhat!

Perhaps, have a listen to this month's competition entries - there'll be at least three high quality entries (alas, not mine), have a listen & check out what gear the guys used?

Nitebob

I have Focusrite Scarlet 2i2 which is good all round. A Condensor mike. The Scarlett came with Ableton....still looking for the right drums solution. Using a synthesizer (keyboard) gives a realistic sound, but my timing sucks (I am not a drummer...) Ableton seems to get the timing perfect but sounds....k...not good....

Or you could check the classifieds...Giggsy has got something there that might work

Badapple

Heya badapple,

I've been trying (with a low degree of success ) to combine a recording setup and a live performance setup. Asked a few questions here, ignored the sage advice of the experienced gfsa'ers (who've posted here as well). I did a quick write-up which (if you are interested) here : http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/the_guide_to/an_alternative_to_recording_guitar_based_material.html.

I'm still using it, and I'm working around the limitations - No FX loops for external pedals (grrr), a wobbly laptop (double grrrr) and a lack of patience (sigh). One thing I did learn, throwing $ at it didn't help - investing time & energy in figuring out what and how I wanted to do is helping somewhat!

Perhaps, have a listen to this month's competition entries - there'll be at least three high quality entries (alas, not mine), have a listen & check out what gear the guys used?

Helpful article!

I was wondering where one could few the challenge recordings..?

Or you could check the classifieds...Giggsy has got something there that might work

Thanks will check it out.

:goodtimes:

AlanRatcliffe

I was also going to mention the Focusrite 2i2, which is all most people will need.

Small PA (thinking a powered mixer & passive speakers will work) - Could I use the monitor I use for recording?

Rather go passive mixer and powered speakers - easier upgrade path and many powered speakers can be kept and used as monitors when you upgrade your rig (or when you need more power for a bigger gig just hire a power amp and speakers and use your powered speakers as monitors.

Speaking upgrade paths - if you plan on growing and expanding, always bear your upgrade path in mind. Like the example above or buying powered speakers that have a matching powered sub which you can add on later as your needs grow. Make sure that when you buy your mixer, that it has enough features which allow you to grow without having to upgrade: effects sends; monitor sends; inserts; EQ and effects that can be switched to monitor sends; and always buy a mixer with more channels than you need ?. This approach will save you a ton of money over time.

Never a good idea to use studio monitors live for a number of reasons (not ruggedised for live use, different dispersion patterns, etc.

Mic (same mic I use for the recording?)

Yup - SM58s are the standard for stage. As your studio grows and you expand to better mics for studio purposes, it'll still be taking a pounding on stage (see: upgrade paths above ?).

Generally I try stay away from Behringer, not only for the oft-cited ethical reasons, but also simply because (IMHO) the more Behringer in a rig, the worse the sound. It used to be that they were the only real budget option, but there are so many brands now (and some of the better brands have produced downscaled offerings) that they have serious competition these days and spending a little more often gets you something far better. Also Behringer gear has very bad resale value, so it actually costs you more when it comes to upgrade time.

Obviously good,durable and quality cables

Learn to make your own and save tens of thousands in the long run. Use quality plugs and they will last you a lifetime, but start thinking of the cable themselves as expendables. ?

Whew! Hope that helps (it better, after all I've typed and thought about on this topic ?).

Badapple

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: I was also going to mention the Focusrite 2i2, which is all most people will need.

Small PA (thinking a powered mixer & passive speakers will work) - Could I use the monitor I use for recording?
Rather go passive mixer and powered speakers - easier upgrade path and many powered speakers can be kept and used as monitors when you upgrade your rig (or when you need more power for a bigger gig just hire a power amp and speakers and use your powered speakers as monitors.

Speaking upgrade paths - if you plan on growing and expanding, always bear your upgrade path in mind. Like the example above or buying powered speakers that have a matching powered sub which you can add on later as your needs grow. Make sure that when you buy your mixer, that it has enough features which allow you to grow without having to upgrade: effects sends; monitor sends; inserts; EQ and effects that can be switched to monitor sends; and always buy a mixer with more channels than you need ?. This approach will save you a ton of money over time.

Never a good idea to use studio monitors live for a number of reasons (not ruggedised for live use, different dispersion patterns, etc.

Mic (same mic I use for the recording?)
Yup - SM58s are the standard for stage. As your studio grows and you expand to better mics for studio purposes, it'll still be taking a pounding on stage (see: upgrade paths above ?).

Generally I try stay away from Behringer, not only for the oft-cited ethical reasons, but also simply because (IMHO) the more Behringer in a rig, the worse the sound. It used to be that they were the only real budget option, but there are so many brands now (and some of the better brands have produced downscaled offerings) that they have serious competition these days and spending a little more often gets you something far better. Also Behringer gear has very bad resale value, so it actually costs you more when it comes to upgrade time.

Obviously good,durable and quality cables
Learn to make your own and save tens of thousands in the long run. Use quality plugs and they will last you a lifetime, but start thinking of the cable themselves as expendables. ?

Whew! Hope that helps (it better, after all I've typed and thought about on this topic ?).

Ok so due to upgrades I will use the passive mixer and powered speakers.. I was looking to get a mixer with more channels than I need but thanks anyway ?

I will scrap the Behringer equipment then and look for better quality. I have absolutely no knowledge in this aspect so any recommended brands?

Thanks for the effort Alan ?

:goodtimes:

AlanRatcliffe

Yamaha, Soundcraft and Alesis do great mixers in the relatively budget ranges. For powered speakers look at the Wharfedale Titan 12 actives and the Proel Flash 12s.

Other people will likely have other options - I don't get to see everything on the PA side these days (aside from some ubiquitous brands like Yamaha and Mackie, PA tends to be more regional because of shipping weight).

Badapple

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: Yamaha, Soundcraft and Alesis do great mixers in the relatively budget ranges. For powered speakers look at the Wharfedale Titan 12 actives and the Proel Flash 12s.

Other people will likely have other options - I don't get to see everything on the PA side these days (aside from some ubiquitous brands like Yamaha and Mackie, PA tends to be more regional because of shipping weight).

Thanks Alan will give it a look into ?

:goodtimes:

exsanguinator

Geez R17K +...?
I'd rather go to ebay and get a used HDD recorder like Roland,Korg,Zoom(with drum Machine),Boss Tascam etc etc
They are dirt cheap now that PC software is more popular.(some are small enough to carry(as onboard luggage)with you on your round the world trip)
Some come with PC software to expand them.
Most units have a CD burner and usb output so you can finish up on a pc by drag and drop
Mics?give away prices
Postage?..cheaper than you think
Then get a power amp and monitors here as the HDD recorder is essentially a mixer with a HDD and can record your live stuff.then polish and edit it..etc
With the balance of dosh,buy a round the world airticket and have a ball

AlanRatcliffe

exsanguinator wrote: I'd rather go to ebay and get a used HDD recorder like Roland,Korg,Zoom(with drum Machine),Boss Tascam etc etc

Which only replaces the interface and computer (which is something most people already have anyway - or at least the ones here). So not really a saving and absolutely no upgrade path on most of them.

V8

exsanguinator wrote: Geez R17K +...?
With the balance of dosh,buy a round the world airticket and have a ball

I really like your thinking...but when last did you go flight shopping? ? The tickets I've seen start @ around 30k...

My mate's zoom is surprisingly good for quick and easy recordings, but we usually break out the laptops & sound cards for anything 'quality'.
I prefer the User Interface on a computer, I do recall the days of working with a cassette tape based '4 track' in the early 90's...demanded a lot of attention&precision. Hmmm, I probably did better recordings with that than I am now though :-\