wood bleach

Gearhead

Being new in the country I haven't yet found addresses for all guitar tech goodies and there's actually stuff StewMac do not sell.
I have been looking for wood bleach for over a year now, to no avail. If I can't get any soon, I will need to change plans and I always find that particularly hard.
In case you're wondering why: I got it into my head to follow the Fender sunburst method they used between '56 and '63 (according to Yasuhiko Iwanade). It calls for the body to first be bleached in order to get a uniform color to start with. After that, the lacquer layers come on with their respective dyes / stains. The maple top that I put on this ash body is a little different in color and it would be nice to even things out. The black edge will hide the glue line, but front and back should not be, like, two shades apart....

Does anybody have any information on where to get WOOD bleach?

MikeM

You know, I read something about bleaching wood if you burn it while getting poly off but I was really unsure what they were talking about. Well now I know that my idea was right ?

Not sure where you can get any man, but best of luck finding some!

AlanRatcliffe

I don't think it's marketed specifically as a wood bleach here, but I'm sure if you look around for them under their chemical names, you will find them somewhere.

There are three types of bleaches used to bleach wood: Oxalic acid, sodium hypochlorite (chlorine bleach) or a two part A/B wood bleach (which is a combination of sodium hydroxide and hydrogen peroxide, and is applied separately to the wood). The oxalic is most commonly used, two part is safest and easiest to use, and sodium hypochlorite is generally avoided (but can be used in a pinch).

Otherwise - have you glued the cap on yet? If not, you could put a black pinstripe of wood between the maple and ash to separate them which will lessen the difference in contrast (and looks quite classy too). Another option would be to do a natural masked binding a la PRS.

Gearhead

Thx alot Alan, much appreciated. Will go look, chemicals is not really my strong suit. I think I need to look for the A/B type first since I am a bleaching noob. Am worried about cleaning the wood after bleaching, any bleach left will apparently also bleach the yellow stain. I can't just go and rinse with water since I used white (hide?) glue which is water soluble.
I have the maple on, but since the finish is to be sunburst the glueline will be hidden by the black anyway.
I used to admire the PRSses but now I feel the carving is too steep and aggressive, the 'horn' looks too thin and the maple binding you mention just does not cut it. I bet that plastic binding is a better protection for your top. It certainly is a lot easier to replace.

AlanRatcliffe

Gearhead wrote: Am worried about cleaning the wood after bleaching, any bleach left will apparently also bleach the yellow stain.

The two parts actually neutralise each other, but you should also wipe down with a 1:2 vinegar to water mix.

I can't just go and rinse with water since I used white (hide?) glue which is water soluble.

Not a problem white (also called carpenters or cold) glue can withstand a bit of water once it's cured - you'd have to soak it for days to loosen a join. BTW: Hide glue (also called hot glue) is of animal origin and melts when it is hot and cures when cool. Resistant to water, but tends to crystallise after a few decades.

I bet that plastic binding is a better protection for your top. It certainly is a lot easier to replace.

It is, but has the downside that it makes the edge quite sharp.

Gearhead

So which part (sodium hydroxide and hydrogen peroxide) does one use first? I've got "bijtsoda" in flakes that you need to dissolve. I also have hydrogen peroxyde in water that says "40 volume" on the bottle, apparently this is the highest concentration that pharmacies can supply.

I have tried stronger and stronger concentrations of either chemical on scrap wood and NONE of my test samples have so much as changed one shade. I on the other hand am getting a 'whiter shade of pale' and wish I did not want to bleach this f#$&cking guitar at all. But I do. >☹

Would you say I should go for the chlorine, or is there something weird I'm doing wrong?

AlanRatcliffe

"Bijtsoda", AKA "Bytsoda" is caustic soda/sodium hydroxide in flake form - dissolve in hot water and allow to cool before using. Remember to use plastic or glass containers, not metal.

There are two methods that can be used:

Method 1:
Mix equal parts hydrogen peroxide sodium hydroxide solution and apply evenly to clean dry wood surface. Wet area thoroughly and completely, but don’t flood. Bleach is self-neutralized when completely dry, usually after 24 hours.

Method 2:
Apply liberal coat of sodium hydroxide solution to surface. Allow to penetrate approximately five to 10 minutes. While surface is still wet, apply liberal coat of hydrogen peroxide and allow to dry overnight. Repeat bleaching if more colour needs to be removed. When final colour is achieved, neutralize surface with mixture of two parts water with one part vinegar.

Bear in mind that you're not going to see major changes in maple, which is already a very pale wood. The bleaching is more to even out differences between examples of the same species of wood.

Gearhead

Thx, will try ??? ☹

The photo's I've seen on the web make it really look pale (can't find link just now...). I just want to get the pinkish out of the maple and bring the ash parts closer together. Should've gone for an opaque first build...

Gearhead

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/tele-home-depot/170911-bleaching-figured-maple.html

Works now! Turns out at 4x the soda concentration I was using before, it does affect the maple. Dissolving the flakes is a bit heavy on the nerves since there is some hissing and popping and I'm not an alchemist. Now to do the guitar itself....

aja

Just chuck it into the washing machine.

Oh and add some stay-soft fabric softner ?

AlanRatcliffe

aja wrote: Just chuck it into the washing machine. Oh and add some stay-soft fabric softner ?

..that's all I have to say about that. ?

aja

Alan Ratcliffe wrote:

..that's all I have to say about that. ?

☹

:-[