nick_D01
hey guys
i've (another) query/question ? :
will one have 100% tuning stability with zero deviation when playing a geet with a double locking system (floyd rose/kahler/ibanez edge). i'm not really referring to how to make a floating trem stay in tune and how to avoid going out of tune after some serious steve vai/jimi/eddie whammy bar madness. i guess i'd just like to know in general if having a double locking geet will really help keep things in tune.
singemonkey
Yes. Bear in mind, not everyone likes the tone from these systems. But they certainly do what they say on the box. As far as I know, there's a little bit of fine tuning when the strings are new, but then you need not worry for long periods of time.
Stubbs
Floyds can handle some crazy whammy bits - think Kirk Hammett, For Whom the Bell Tolls.
Sorry to hijack - what about the normal tremolo on a Strat?
Would replacing the tuning pegs with locking pegs help?
Gearhead
Yes and no; it is not about locking. If both sides lock, the guitar will still expand differently from the strings. The piece of wood that it is, gets bigger as the temperature or humidity go up. The strings don't stretch with humidity rise, but stretch more than the wood with temperature. The thing with a Floyd is that it attaches the strings to a spring, which takes the length of the guitar out of the equation. I would say that any floating trem, with or without locking whatever, should stay in tune as long as the friction on the nut is low enough.
arjunmenon
Re 100% tuning stability - AFAIK, Not possible. Even across different brands, the strings stretch out and settle in differently.
I have seen/played a Strat (incidentally owned by a forumite) that stayed in tune very well after using the vibrato.
I think you're always going to have a little bit of a compromise. What works for me now is a floating trem set-up with locking tuners and a graphtech nut.
But even this isn't fool-proof. However, with floyd rose equipped guitars, maintaining the tuning is a pain, what with having to unlock the nut etc etc.
If you do go down the FR road, here's what used to work for me with my FR equipped Ibanez:
1. Check intonation - at the frets, at the bridge, check the string's angle over the nut when you fret at the 2nd fret (Thanks Mojo Jojoe).
2. Check that the strings are nicely stretched out and allow them to settle properly - D'Addarios used to take me 9 - 11 days. Ernie balls it takes me 3 - 4 days.
3. Check the number of winds you've got on the post and that the winds aren't messy and climbing over each other - The less it slips there, the easier it is to maintain tuning.
4. Check consistency & firmness of the machineheads - Especially when you turn the key and you find a little bit of play or nothing happens to the pitch
5. Accuracy of the nut - height, depth, E to E spread and that it doesn't catch the string.
6. Check the break angle of the string - Especially on an FR where the string travels over the nut & under the retainer bar
7. The straighter the string travels to the post, the better your chances of having proper tuning.
8. Ensure the angle of the bridge is set properly.
9. Ensure that the trem springs are tensioned properly.
10. Ensure that the knife edge of the FR and the posts that it rests on are burr-free and as smooth as possible.
Averatu
Gearhead
Never mind Floyd. The thing that convinced me is that I got a semi-hollow that was fitted with a Bigsby and found it rarely goes out of tune. The construction of this guitar, with all its untreated thin wood, is one that would deform quite a bit with the weather. There is no locking tuners or nut or whatever, still it holds its tuning remarkably well.
ZarK
The only guitar I've owned that stays perfectly in tune -even when stored for months and/or subjected to temperature- and moisture changes is my '91 Jem. I've never had the privilege of owning or playing any other non-double locking axe that comes close to the stability of this guitar... In my experience if you're after uber tuning stability, a high-end double locking guitar -preferably with a Lo Pro Edge- or Edge Floyd Rose is still the benchmark.
nick_D01
hey guys
thanks so much for all the info/tips/pointers.
my motivation for posting this query is i would like a guitar to tune down 1 step to 'd', 2 steps down to 'c' or even baritone tuning (2 and a half steps). i'm thinking about getting the ibanez mick thomson signature (cheaper, bolt-on neck model). it has a fixed bridge, but its a double locking one. i was thinking i could string it up with, at most 11's, and use it for all this down tuning and the locking system will keep everythin nicely in tune (even down 2 and a half steps).
ZarK
For 2-1/2 steps down you're probably going to have to go with at least 12's imo. Also, to get the right action and intonation, technically you'll have to readjust the saddles and truss-rod every time you change tuning. Personally with my guitars, tuning between 1 and 2-1/2 teps down would mean I'd need at least 3 different string gauges to cover all those lower tunings -each time with truss-rod adjustment... Maybe I'm just a bit OCD with how I tune and setup my instruments... 11's would be a good average but in my experience would not cut it for 2 or more steps down on a RG... Maybe it's just personal preference? Ideally if you're after best tuning stability, especially if you're tuning that low, you should stick with 1 tuning and find the ideal string gauge for that tuning + adjust truss-rod over time until the instrument settles at that tuning. I think that a double-locking fixed bridge RG should offer fantastic tuning stability once the guitar has settled in.
singemonkey
Zark's right. Ideally, with big tuning changes you want different strings and a guitar adjustment. I have a guitar that swings between open E and standard. Thank goodness it's a maple neck bolt-on, or I don't think it'd stand it. As it is the guitar takes strain, and it's not ideal. The ideal is setting up a guitar for a particular tuning - which also means a particular string gauge.
