NOAD!!

kayDUB

New Old Amp Day! Ok, well a few days ago :?

Picked up the bassman head from Nick the weekend before last - silverface 68/69 AB165, there are some other threads about this amp. Looks to me like it had the drip edge finish at some stage.

I then happened to stumble upon the cab a few days later. Its a 2 x 12" bassman cab from what I can tell. It looks quite original to me, apart from the speaker grill cloth, speakers and possibly the tolex ?.
Pine finger jointed cab, MDF back board and baffle, piggy back screws, original-looking hardware including tilt back legs!
Some weird speakers called "Bulldog" which I can't find much info on.
Anyone have any insight into this cab? I guess it is a 68/69 bassman cab... ?

I'll post more detailed pics in a bit.

My plan is to restore the grill cloth to something more original and replace the speakers - need suggestions! The best I can describe the tone I'm looking for in my head is clean, detailed, clear, lots of character (or "flavour"). They shouldn't breakup too soon as I use the amp pretty clean with drive from pedals. I use lots of delay - think Edge/Johnny Buckland (please no de-rails ? ) I'm thinking Weber Blue Dog/Silver Bell or the Weber Jensen equivalents (P12N I think).

I'm also thinking of fixing up the head cosmetically a bit.
I haven't had a chance to open it up much yet, but it does seem like the current speakers "blanket" the sound a bit. But I don't really have much of a reference when it comes to bassmen (?) ?

AlanRatcliffe

kayDUB wrote Some weird speakers called "Bulldog" which I can't find much info on.

Union Jack and a pic of a Bulldog on the label? Bothner's own PA speaker brand about 15 years ago - they used them to make cheap speaker cabs. Cheap Asian jobbies. Actually work better as guitar speakers than PA speakers, but not particularly good either way.

I'm thinking Weber Blue Dog/Silver Bell or the Weber Jensen equivalents (P12N I think).

Both great choices, but quite different. The ceramic California 12s are the same kind of thing as, but better than the Jensens (a bit smoother under drive). Blue Dog and Silver Bell are a match made in heaven (I have the alnicos in my Twin) - The Blue dog gives you the gorgeous chime while the Silver Bell fills in and tightens up the low end. Together they handle clean to rocky dirt very well.

But I don't really have much of a reference when it comes to bassmen (?) ?

Pretty much your standard silverface sound - gorgeous cleans to slightly gritty dirt.

nick

It looks good with the new badge on, congrats 8)

kayDUB

Finger-jointed; albeit not very nicely ?

MDF backboard and baffle:

Pat Pend and serial nr:

One of the piggyback bushings has the screw broken off in it..

vic

Nice rig KayDUB ! Congrats. !
You will get a better sound from the cab if you put some "sponge" in the 2 compartments of the cab. The original cabs had a "fibreglass-like" spongy material in there.

singemonkey

Congrats.

If it's the earlier black-face circuit, my feeling - as always - would be to put in low-efficiency speakers and an attenuator and get amp drive with your guitar volume knob. Even like that, you should be able to get the amp really clean at high volume by turning the attenuator way up (see the current amp fight thread). But that way you'd have the option of amp drive - the tastiest drive of all.

Anyway, great amp no matter what. Enjoy.

kayDUB

Alan Ratcliffe wrote
kayDUB wrote Some weird speakers called "Bulldog" which I can't find much info on.
Union Jack and a pic of a Bulldog on the label? Bothner's own PA speaker brand about 15 years ago - they used them to make cheap speaker cabs. Cheap Asian jobbies. Actually work better as guitar speakers than PA speakers, but not particularly good either way.

Those are the ones! If google doesn't know, ask Alan ?

I'm thinking Weber Blue Dog/Silver Bell or the Weber Jensen equivalents (P12N I think).
Both great choices, but quite different. The ceramic California 12s are the same kind of thing as, but better than the Jensens (a bit smoother under drive). Blue Dog and Silver Bell are a match made in heaven (I have the alnicos in my Twin) - The Blue dog gives you the gorgeous chime while the Silver Bell fills in and tightens up the low end. Together they handle clean to rocky dirt very well.

Sounds yummy!

kayDUB

Thanks Nick, Vic and Singe!

Vic wrote
Nice rig KayDUB ! Congrats. !
You will get a better sound from the cab if you put some "sponge" in the 2 compartments of the cab. The original cabs had a "fibreglass-like" spongy material in there.

Yeah, I wondered about that... While I had it open I got really itchy, so I assume it had it in at some stage. What specific material would you recommend?

kayDUB

singemonkey wrote Congrats.

If it's the earlier black-face circuit, my feeling - as always - would be to put in low-efficiency speakers and an attenuator and get amp drive with your guitar volume knob. Even like that, you should be able to get the amp really clean at high volume by turning the attenuator way up (see the current amp fight thread). But that way you'd have the option of amp drive - the tastiest drive of all.

Anyway, great amp no matter what. Enjoy.

Yeah, I hear what you're saying, but not sure it'll work 100% with the style I'm playing. Could be wrong and it's probably something I should try sometime - but then I have to buy an attenuator ☹ the black hole of gear...

vic

kayDUB wrote Thanks Nick, Vic and Singe!

Vic wrote
Nice rig KayDUB ! Congrats. !
You will get a better sound from the cab if you put some "sponge" in the 2 compartments of the cab. The original cabs had a "fibreglass-like" spongy material in there.
Yeah, I wondered about that... While I had it open I got really itchy, so I assume it had it in at some stage. What specific material would you recommend?

The foam/sponge used for mattresses should work fine I think. Thickness of about 5-10cm should be adequate. Just stuff it round the speakers and close the cab up. Should make a big difference to your sound.

vic

Here's an example

vic

Forgot to mention...the speakers in this cab are Jensen 12" ceramics...great sounding speakers...lots of mids and excellent clarity.

kayDUB

Thanks Vic. That looks like fibreglass.

I'm really torn regarding speakers...

Alan, will the alnico bluedog/silverbell also have a bit of a mid hump?

AlanRatcliffe

kayDUB wrote Thanks Vic. That looks like fibreglass.

It is fibreglass, but it's denser than Aerolite. You can also use rockwool/mineral wool and avoid the itchies of fibreglass. Most commonly available foams are the wrong type - there is a big difference between open and closed cell types.

Alan, will the alnico bluedog/silverbell also have a bit of a mid hump?

No. It's a very well balanced combo. The Fender BF/SF amps have a bit of a mid scoop and the usual Ceramic Jensens tend to accentuate that while the BD/SB combo evens it out a bit (but adds a few nice spikes in the upper mids that add a bit of a Voxy chime).

If you want to make a pilgrimage out my way sometime, you're welcome to plug your head into my Twin's pair (it's quite a serious investment for the pair - especially the Alnico versions).

Also speak to Weber directly (Ted's son) - he is very good at recommending speakers as long as you have a clear idea of what you want. My requirements were similar to yours - a more balanced tone but more chime (I love the Vox tone, but want the clarity of the Fenders) and he steered me right to the BD/SB combo. I couldn't be happier.

kayDUB

Alan Ratcliffe wrote
Alan, will the alnico bluedog/silverbell also have a bit of a mid hump?
No. It's a very well balanced combo. The Fender BF/SF amps have a bit of a mid scoop and the usual Ceramic Jensens tend to accentuate that while the BD/SB combo evens it out a bit (but adds a few nice spikes in the upper mids that add a bit of a Voxy chime).

This has pretty much convinced me that the Blue Dog/Silver Bell is the way to go for me...

If you want to make a pilgrimage out my way sometime, you're welcome to plug your head into my Twin's pair (it's quite a serious investment for the pair - especially the Alnico versions).

Also speak to Weber directly (Ted's son) - he is very good at recommending speakers as long as you have a clear idea of what you want. My requirements were similar to yours - a more balanced tone but more chime (I love the Vox tone, but want the clarity of the Fenders) and he steered me right to the BD/SB combo. I couldn't be happier.

Thanks for the offer Alan! That would be cool, I just don't know when... will be in touch tho.
And yes at $205 each I'm sure its going to work out to a lot of ZARs! What did yours come in at?
I will contact Weber.

AlanRatcliffe

Fortunately, I kept a close and exact tally on everything for this article: http://articles.guitarforum.co.za/blogs/alan-ratcliffe/importing-gear-%E2%80%93-real-costs where I published a breakdown of all the costs involved, from the speakers themselves to my bank's charges.

Total was R5,635.45 - and that was two years ago... They might have found a cheaper/better shipping solution than FedEx by now. Unfortunately the weight of a pair of 12" alnicos pushes it out of contention for USPS.

Warren

Wow, awesome amp Kev! 8) 8)

kayDUB

Thanks ... Shreddy ?

Thanks for that Alan! That's crazy $$$ ? But probably worth it in the long run. MUST...SELL...STUFF...

shaunf

Congrats on the amp, dude! Many happy miles!

kayDUB

Thanks Shaun!