epictring
Hi guys, today I (who lives in Welkom) went to JHB for a private(ish) "tour" of The Academy of Sound Engineering or also known as ASE.
Phil gave me the tour, their studios and work areas are all based in the SABC building itself, which is kind of cool. It all seems really awesome and exciting to study and all since it covers such a broad spectrum (Studio Recordings, Live Sound, Lighting, Stage Design etc etc)
Now I obviously want an honest opinion from you guys about them and if it really is as good as it looks on paper?
How are the job-opportunities afterwards?
$$$ Income for such a job?
and so on.
If I will be enrolling it would be in 2013, I already passed the "interview".
VellaJ
Well I can't comment on ASE, but I can comment on job opportunities...
It appears, unless you work for a major corporation, job opportunities are few and far between. My guitar tutor runs his own small recording studio, and he says there's such a small market it can't pay the bills on it's own. That's why he teaches. I was asking him about this yesterday in fact, and he says that, in terms of money, payment agreed to between the parties is so negotiable due to there being so little demand. But to give you an idea, he charges R350 per hour for studio time, with a ceiling of R2,500.
Possible reasons for small demand? Anyone with a computer these days can record their own stuff as a demo. Then they send on to bigger companies for the professional stuff, if they make it.
Sorry to be so negative man, but this is something I've picked up in the past year or two...
Manfred-Klose
unless you have friends or good contacts, i would not recommend going into sound.
i did sound fulltime for 2 years of my life, yes it was fun and i had the best time of my life, but you work longs hours, and not always get the best pay for the job.
first make sure if this is the direction you want to do for the rest of your life.
or if you perhaps rather want a stable income from a job
Hammeron
There is a big wide world out there that I am sure is full wonderfull opportunities for engineers particularly if they are good musicians as well.
What I mean is, looking beyond the boundaries of SA might be the way to go.
Bob-Dubery
Are we talking about live sound and studio work with musicians here? Surely there are options in advertising, TV and film as well?
I would think that's likely to be freelance work. I have friends in the movie industry and they make good money when they work, but they don't work from 9 to 5, 5 days a week and get a fixed pay packet at the end of the month. This may suit you! (it suits said friends).
There are people running studios (often as one of several things that they do) who are making a living or at least enough that it pays them to keep the studio open. That doesn't guarantee success and a fortune for everybody who graduates from ASE.
In the meantime do some research and try to get an idea of the opportunities, the risks, the rewards.
blues_addict
I completed my studies at ASE in 2008. I was second in my class, had lots of experience (HG Skouspel, Live@5, 5FM Recordings at OppiKoppi etc.) and it didn't help me jack to get a job IN SOUND. I currently do coprorate AV and Video Conferencing and control systems which is quite far from what I studied. My point is if you think you are going to get a good job in live or studio by studying, I'm sorry to break it to you. There are jobs in the corporate sector doing what I do.
Post Production has a hand full more jobs but you need to know someone who knows the boss, that's it.
Sorry if I sound a bit negative, this is my experience. Like I said there are jobs in the corporate sector, these you can get without wasting an obscene amount of money on studies.
P.S. Studying at ASE was a blast never the less!! ?
epictring
Damn that is horrible news. I do have the opportunity to go overseas if I'd like. Is the situation a lot different overseas?
guidothepimmp
overseas youd be better off with an internationally recognized course or degree, coupled with experience.
Manfred-Klose
go overseas if have a chance to go!!!!!! its a big world out there
epictring
Anyone knows if the ASE course is internationally recognized? They said something about it being. But I want to make sure by you guys..
guidothepimmp
Dont know about ASE, there should be a way of checking online..
Also find out where it is recognized...
Dont mean to put you off,
I have 2 cousins, 1 in Ireland and 1 in Ingeland both with Masters degrees in Music and all the courses that go with sound engineering etc.
None of them work in music because they could not get into a saturated industry. Just a heads up, give it a whirl but be prepared for all eventualities.
Good luck eitherway man
AlanRatcliffe
I have a three year degree and never managed to find work in a studio. It's the same everywhere and ultimately the training does help you learn your craft and helps you as a muso too. Musically it's one of the best things I ever did.
But it doesn't stand for a great deal in the job stakes - you'll still have to wheedle your way into a studio at the bottom, working unpaid at first and spend years before you end up behind a console. Dedication and sheer bloody-mindedness will get you further than your qualification. The industry is in a bad state at the moment, with home recording taking most of the small studio's bread and butter demo work and the top studios having their pick of thousands of good engineers with decades of experience. It's still possible to make it, but you'd better be really good and be prepared to be in it for the long haul and for the possibility of not succeeding.
For what it's worth, the ASA are Protools certified, which is as close as you get to an industry standard certification. You'd still stand more chance if you trained at one of the big US places. Go to the US and you're in the same market competing with the Berklee grads...
epictring
What a letdown. :-\
Guess I'm back to the drawing board.
Bob-Dubery
epictring wrote:
Damn that is horrible news. I do have the opportunity to go overseas if I'd like. Is the situation a lot different overseas?
Which part of "overseas"? Britain is not good right now, large chunks of Europe are worse. I am born in the UK and can walk back in any time I want, and I'm not keen. It would be very hard for me to get into the job market there now - unless I wanted to stack shelves in a supermarket or something.
I think for sound guys it would be similar to musicians. Sure there are a lot more opportunities, but also there's a lot more competition.
Obviously there are jobs, but it's not quite the land of milk and honey. The global economic downturn is global.
Make sure all your paperwork is in order BEFORE you leave and understand exactly what you're entitled to and for how long.
IceCreamMan
studying an not finding a job in that field is not restricted to sound engineering ....its all over..i read that ZA has something like 600 000 ppl with degrees who are unemployed ...
also , my vocation is hardly related to any of the studies i have done ... am currently studying to complete my law degree which is related to what i do but previous degree studies have been pretty unrelated. i believe 95% of ppl that complete a degree do not work in the field they studied...thats a high number
Point is dont be discouraged, if you like sound then go an study it....studying and being a student is a blast and if u can afford it do it.... strues nuts if i won the lotto i would go back to studying full time and die with 10 degrees, a Dr title and happy as a clam.
Knowledge is never wasted and even though i am not in my field of study i can guarantee you that my previous studies opened doors as a foot in the door.
BTW , sound engineering can be profitbale ... ad agencies spend zillions on jingles and voice related stuff per annum....
Hammeron
IceCreamMan wrote:
studying an not finding a job in that field is not restricted to sound engineering ....its all over..i read that ZA has something like 600 000 ppl with degrees who are unemployed ...
also , my vocation is hardly related to any of the studies i have done ... am currently studying to complete my law degree which is related to what i do but previous degree studies have been pretty unrelated. i believe 95% of ppl that complete a degree do not work in the field they studied...thats a high number
Point is dont be discouraged, if you like sound then go an study it....studying and being a student is a blast and if u can afford it do it.... strues nuts if i won the lotto i would go back to studying full time and die with 10 degrees, a Dr title and happy as a clam.
Knowledge is never wasted and even though i am not in my field of study i can guarantee you that my previous studies opened doors as a foot in the door.
BTW , sound engineering can be profitbale ... ad agencies spend zillions on jingles and voice related stuff per annum....
Thank you.
Hammeron
What about this:
You are a talented and dedicated musician.
You have learnt the ins and outs of engineering at the ASE.
You get together with a few of your ilk.
You open your own 'state of the art studio' in a major center.
And you go for it.
Yes you will need to raise a truckload of cash.
I am sure there is a great need for such facilities?
Just a thought.
epictring
Its a hard decision. ☹
But I'll do some more research and so on.
Thanks a lot for the replied thus far.
blues_addict
epictring wrote:
Anyone knows if the ASE course is internationally recognized? They said something about it being. But I want to make sure by you guys..
The Diploma they offer is accredited through WITS if I understand correctly, which may mean you'll get some recognition. As for the ProTools certification, that's something awesome to have on your name overseas.
aja
Alan Ratcliffe wrote:
I have a three year degree and never managed to find work in a studio. It's the same everywhere and ultimately the training does help you learn your craft and helps you as a muso too. Musically it's one of the best things I ever did.
But it doesn't stand for a great deal in the job stakes - you'll still have to wheedle your way into a studio at the bottom, working unpaid at first and spend years before you end up behind a console. Dedication and sheer bloody-mindedness will get you further than your qualification. The industry is in a bad state at the moment, with home recording taking most of the small studio's bread and butter demo work and the top studios having their pick of thousands of good engineers with decades of experience. It's still possible to make it, but you'd better be really good and be prepared to be in it for the long haul and for the possibility of not succeeding.
For what it's worth, the ASA are Protools certified, which is as close as you get to an industry standard certification. You'd still stand more chance if you trained at one of the big US places. Go to the US and you're in the same market competing with the Berklee grads...
What I get from this, is that if you are willing to go into various fields in the music industry, pursuing a qualification in sound can only be of benefit. However, if your goal is to go purely into sound, the job market is simply not there. So the sound qualification should be seen like the MBA of the music world - it is an added benefit to an existing skill set, but not a get out of jail card...
Or along those lines?
