petermoffat
I spent a fair amount of time over the holidays strumming away on the old guitar, my sisters nylon string when we were down in the Cape, and my steel string acoustic after we got back, and just had a really good time jamming with some mates at the local.. It's funny how suddenly you've learned a few things and can play a tune and can't remember when it all came together from struggling to finger a d chord or whatever, hey?
I recently got an electric guitar as well, but the thing really stumps me, so I need some help please.
I fiddle with the pickup selector and tone, leave the amp hi/mid/lo settings alone, and either add lots of gain or little gain, but the sound never sounds like anything I hear online? The distortion is either so much you can hardly pick out the sound of the chord or notes, or hardly distorted, in which case it almost always sounds like a tinny mess.
I understand this may be related to (in part) cheap pickups, cheap amp, and (mostly) poor player (yours truly), but while I'm learning, are there any tips to get say cool bluesy tones, or a decent over-driven sound?
I've had the guitar with a guy to do the setup, and he quite liked it (It's a cheap Washburn RX10), so in terms of hardware, it leaves the amp, which I'm considering replacing to get one of the fancier mini models with amp emulation. Any experience with these?
Finally (and, most importantly!), I haven't played it too much, but the overriding thing I've learned is that it is NOT an acoustic guitar.
I'm used to strumming out a tune, but I never see anyone do that on an electric, it's all fingers flying up and down the fretboard and bending strings and what not. How do I learn to do that?? ???
Warren
Can you give us some more info on the amp that you're using?
petermoffat
A cheap one ?
It's a 10W washburn guy that came as part of the kit, but to be honest I know very little about this stuff, how much difference does the amp make in terms of the type of sound? I understand that a valve amp would obviously sound better, but at this stage I'm just trying to get the same type of sound, and have no idea how to set what. The guitar has 3 pickups, neck and middle single coil, and a bridge humbucker.
Warren
petermoffat wrote:
A cheap one ?
It's a 10W washburn guy that came as part of the kit, but to be honest I know very little about this stuff, how much difference does the amp make in terms of the type of sound? I understand that a valve amp would obviously sound better, but at this stage I'm just trying to get the same type of sound, and have no idea how to set what. The guitar has 3 pickups, neck and middle single coil, and a bridge humbucker.
Cool stuff, just wanted some idea what you were using. Taking it the amp does not have any effects such as reverb, delay etc. built into it?
AlanRatcliffe
The amp has a huge effect on the sound of the guitar - it's as much a part of "the electric guitar sound" as the guitar itself (if not more).
Typically the little entry-level solidstates are not great and the distortion circuits are harsh and rather abrupt (by that I mean they don't transition gradually from clean to dirty along with playing dynamics - which is key for a good blues guitar sound).
I think the best thing you can do is upgrade your amp - try find a Roland Micro Cube (or any of the Cubes) or one of the smaller Vox modelling amps - they sound decent and can be picked up for cheap on the secondhand market. Also a very good thing about the modelling amps is they give you an introduction to the main types of amp available (Fender, Vox, Marshall, Mesa) and can point you in the right direction when you want to upgrade.
Otherwise, if the budget is tight, you can look for an overdrive pedal to put between your guitar and amp to handle the overdrive sounds instead of the amp distortion.
fjcdt
biggest difference between acoustic and electric guitars when you just start out is the lack of a bell/chime/ring tone that your use to from the acoustic.
Since i dont think the 10watter has much in the wat of built in effects what are you going for.
What do you want to play?
take into account overdubs, tuning, pickups and effects all add to what you hear online.
ezietsman
petermoffat wrote:
how much difference does the amp make in terms of the type of sound?
It makes up probably 90% of the tone, as we call it. That said, you can learn (almost) as well to play your electric through that amp as through a valve amp. Valve amps are usually quite limited in the range of sounds you can get and most people on the forum will suggest one of the modelling amps for a beginner. That way they can play around with a range of different amp types and effects and the like to see what they like best, before spending extra $$ on a valve amp.
Usually when playing your electric with more than a bit of distortion, the open chord style of acoustic playing is NOT used because of that mushiness you describe. It is sometimes used for effect though. The string bending and all that has mostly to do with improvising and playing solos over a chord progression. I would suggest you start to learn these techniques at www.justinguitar.com or a similar site. That one is good though and he has many many youtube videos explaining all the concepts.
If you have money to spend and WANT to buy something, get one of the modelling amps. Those tiny practice amps are usually very limited and surprisingly limited in tone too, but yours may be OK, I dunno. The guitar needs to be easy to play also. That is an adjustable thing though and a good setup will make it a breeze to make some music on it, unless there is something wrong with it (unlikely).
What kind of music would you like to play on your electric?
petermoffat
About what I thought, I saw a ice Vox Mini 3, and like what I've seen of the mustang mini, but choice here in Durban is a little limited.. What should I be looking at in terms of spend?
Warren
Alan is right about the amp, hence my questions about it.
I recall being in EXACTLY the same position as you, petermoffat, when I started out on electric: I had a simple low wattage solid state practice amp, and I couldn't figure out how you were supposed to get all these amazing sounds out of it.
It was only when I had the opportunity to plug my guitar into some other amps that I REALLY began to understand what all the fuss was about. Suddenly my guitar sounded so much more "alive", so much better to listen to.
I agree with Alan on the Cube suggestion. The built-in effects provide an excellent intro to the world of electric guitar effects, without requiring you to know much about individual effects pedals.
Otherwise, if you had to pick up a couple of pedals, I'd look at a delay pedal and an overdrive (or distortion, if you like it crunchier). The delay pedal is versatile and will sweeten up the tone of even a cheapie practice amp (my old delay worked to great effect on my old practice amp), and a decent overdrive pedal will give you a hint of what good sounding overdrive can do for you. My Tube Screamer in front of my old practice amp sounded simply amazing (compared to the amp on its own). You can also keep the pedals after you've upgraded your amp.
In terms of play style, electric guitar playing IS a different sort of challenge to acoustic playing. Handling noise, hitting accidental strings when hold chords or notes, failing to mute unwanted strings etc. all have a magnified effect on the electric guitar, and they often don't sound good (whereas on acoustic it can be easier to get away with such things). On the other hand, when playing with some distortion, you can get away with fretting simple power chords (or even two-note "chords") and they sound rich and full. Often, over-driven electric guitars don't sound that great with big "strummy" chords like you'd use on an acoustic, because all the notes bleed into each other and create a bit of a sonic mess. Sometimes that's desirable, but when starting out it can be frustrating when coming over from acoustic.
The good news is that all of the above stuff can be sorted out pretty quickly with practice, and the guidance of a good teacher. Over time, you'll find that you naturally swap between "electric mode" and "acoustic mode" on different instruments.
petermoffat
The guitar has been set up and it plays great to me, much easier than acoustic, and does not buzz.
What are the advantages of a modeling amp over something like the Apogee jam, which I'd really rather spend money on, as more often than not I play through headphones anyway, and like the idea of being able to experiment not only with the different amp models, but also with deifferent effects pedals?
Blerrie JustinGuitar is the reason I've been a member so long and never post! Was mentioned to me when I joined, and I've always felt like I hadn't progressed nearly far enough through the beginners course to get anywhere that I'd need to ask for help on my accoustic. ?
I'm a little more c for table now, but playing was on and off for a while. The combination of finally being able to play and sing a few tunes and the new guitar have made me enjoy it so much again though, I'm really making the time to play more, and due to my current circumstances, and can make a fair bit of time most evenings, so I'm trying to learn as much as I can at a nice and easy pace, taking advantage of it!
Warren
petermoffat wrote:
What are the advantages of a modeling amp over something like the Apogee jam, which I'd really rather spend money on, as more often than not I play through headphones anyway, and like the idea of being able to experiment not only with the different amp models, but also with deifferent effects pedals?
The cool thing about the Apogee Jam / iRig type interfaces is that you can also record your own tracks, which IMO is very useful (you could enter the monthly challenges, for one thing). ? What you won't be able to do much is play aloud, e.g. jamming with some other dudes.
The Roland Cubes usually have an output for headphone play, and they have both amp and effects models as well. However, you won't automatically have an interface for recording any music, but you'll be able to play without headphones.
petermoffat
I suppose I thought I'd just plug the iPad into my current amp when I wanted to play with mates. I like the idea of recording, no idea why though?
Any reccomendations on where to shop for hardware in Durban?
Norman86
personally, i would take the Vox mini 3 or fender mustang mini over a roland cube ANY day!
From there, you should be able to start hearing more of what your hear on youtube!
Check youtube vids for demo's of the mini 3!!
petermoffat
Norman, I'll see if I can find a mustang mini, the demos I've heard of it sound much cooler than the ones of the mini 3.
What sort of money do these things go for?
Norman86
around $130 USD...
Here, i have no idea, best to go into a shop and ask!!
Squonk
Peter
If I was you I wouldn't worry about effects and Tube vs Solid State as yet.
Become comfortable with the Guitar first. Skill up on some of the basics until there is some understanding of Pickups, Tone, string bending etc.
Norman86
Squonk,
What you say is true...
However, if he wants to play with the amp, he needs something that he likes listening to!
I hated my roland cube, so I avoided playing on it!
The Albion however... i LOVE playing on! An amp does wonderful things for you!
Squonk
Norman86 wrote:
Squonk,
What you say is true...
However, if he wants to play with the amp, he needs something that he likes listening to!
I hated my roland cube, so I avoided playing on it!
The Albion however... i LOVE playing on! An amp does wonderful things for you!
There is an element of truth in this. But if I trade my Cube for the Albion I will still be the same K@k player that I am... my point is that there is whole lot to electric guitar playing that has nothing to do with the amp?
I kind of cured my frustration by turning all the effects off, experimenting with all the pickup combinations, just to get a feel of what the Electric guitar can do.
No delay or Chorus to hide my mistakes etc.
But buying a better Amp is always a good option in the long run ?
Attila
Oy ! Normie - theres nothing wrong with a Cubester hey
petermoffat
I hear you Squonk, but ja, as Norman says, it's a total package thing. I know there is a huge amount to learn, but want to want to do it. A part of why I stop started with the acoustic was because practicing chord changes over and over was super boring, but now that I can strum a tune or two, I'm suddenly much more motivated to practice because it sounds cool some of the time ?
