Vick
So yesterday I finally watched The Roast of Carly Sheen, Slash was on the show, playing Slash kinda stuff for Sheen's into music.
I looked away for a second, and heard slow dive bomb kinda whammy thing, slash was playing a les paul, so I rewound the video, and saw slash does this thing, he puts his right hand just past the switch on his les paul, and then applies pressure, his left hand was just below the head stock....is the guy literally bending the guitar, for the strings to slack and thus getting that effect?
Bob-Dubery
I haven't seen this video, but I have seen this technique used before. I think you've seen it correctly. The right hand anchors the body and the left hand moves the headstock and thus takes some tension off of the strings.
VellaJ
My friend used to use this technique with his SG (the older guitars known for having thin necks). It worked fairly well, but I wouldn't call it a "divebomb," AFAIK the only way you can do such an extreme bend is with a whammy. Don't want to break the neck...
Gearhead
You can do about a semitone before it becomes heavy on a singlecut LP. Not uncommon. The flex on the neck in that case is roughly as much as tuning the whole guitar a semitone up, no big deal.
PeachyDragon
I have a friend who bends the guitar like that... with his favourite axe...
I don't think I would do that to my main guitar.
evolucian
when you say "dive bomb" that literally means till the strings are slack. I assume slash's guitar still had its neck intact after that right? So did it drop a tone or a semitone (or even a three semitone drop)? I'd love to have seen it though... sigh... sniff.
In one of Zakk Wylde's columns for Guitar World he gives a lesson on simulating dives (and no neck bending).
Another way, if holding a note, is to really grip it, then move your finger to slacken the string - that equates moving it towards the bridge - and bend the neck a little. When you hear a crack, you might have gone too far, lol. You can get a decent little drop like this (2 to 4 down... but you're tired after it, sigh), just not as effective as those buggers with whammy's... grrrr. Of course you can prebend too... like Zack.
Anyway, would love to have seen the Slash one.
PeachyDragon
Okay, I checked. Slash only got a semitone dive and went back up but it sounded good. Got the effect.
Malkav
I find it kinda funny that we're talking about bending necks in on the brand with the most questionable headstock join in the world...
This is a cross section from a '57 Goldtop Reissues neck...I wonder why it is that the headstocks on LPs tend to break....
Gearhead
Dude... why did you saw your headstock in half? This one wasn't broken (yet).
On a more serious note: I thing the breaking off problem has more to do with the fact that Mahogany has short grain and since they don't scarf glue it on, the grain does not run along the headstock as well. The kind of thin scary cross section like in the picture, you would probably have on a headstock adjustable Strat neck too. In a Strat it does not break since it is nice long grain Maple and it also continues parallel to the grain.
Also, most people push the neck in this kind of bend (dunno what to call it?) at the back behind the 1st-3rd fret rather than at the headstock. If it would break, it would do so at the neck/body join; the moment is bigger there.
deefstes
Has anyone ever heard of this technique actually breaking a neck? I've seen the technique being used many times and I always hear people express their doubtas as to how "safe" it is but I have yet to hear of anyone who's actually broken his guitar neck in the process.
evolucian
Yeah... Ritchie Blackmore... he bent the neck... wasn't good enough.. used the bar... wasn't good enough... used the floor to hold the headstock, wanted true slackness of the strings so gently lifted it and gently brought it back down to meet the ground. It "accidentally" broke. True story, ask Joel... he was there saw it on the dvd too.... lol. He was so sad the guitar broke he threw it into the audience... and in true generous spirit (it might have been christmas) he gave the crowd his amp too.
But in all honesty... we'll have to leave it to newbies to perfect that technique mentioned from the start. The warning is for them. Tommy Emmanuel thrashes the crap out of his neck at one gig and it didn't break... even gave the complimentary whammy bar motion whilst doing it... quite a treat.
Some people push acoustics and electrics too far sometimes. When they hear a little snap, the guitar inevitably is rushed to the guitar hospital with a "I don't know what happened... uhm... I picked up my guitar today and saw this crack there... I'm so devastated. Could it be the weather perhaps?" .... but secretly... those guitar doctors can sometimes tell what happened.
PeachyDragon
Chad Adam Browne wrote:
I find it kinda funny that we're talking about bending necks in on the brand with the most questionable headstock join in the world...
This is a cross section from a '57 Goldtop Reissues neck...I wonder why it is that the headstocks on LPs tend to break....
Ridiculous! There's an article about broken Gibson necks on Edromanguitar.com I think that's their site anyway... I think
Ed is a business man and most of the site should be taken with a grain of salt. Google his name elsewhere to see what I mean, but
it is a fascinating site. Anyhow, he claims that he sees more gibson neck repairs than all the other guitar necks they have repaired put together. He says Epiphones don't break as much, Cheap Gibson copies don't break as much. Maybe this is why.
deefstes
PeachyDragon wrote:
Chad Adam Browne wrote:
I find it kinda funny that we're talking about bending necks in on the brand with the most questionable headstock join in the world...
This is a cross section from a '57 Goldtop Reissues neck...I wonder why it is that the headstocks on LPs tend to break....
Ridiculous! There's an article about broken Gibson necks on Edromanguitar.com I think that's their site anyway... I think
Ed is a business man and most of the site should be taken with a grain of salt. Google his name elsewhere to see what I mean, but
it is a fascinating site. Anyhow, he claims that he sees more gibson neck repairs than all the other guitar necks they have repaired put together. He says Epiphones don't break as much, Cheap Gibson copies don't break as much. Maybe this is why.
I'd like to see a similar cross section of a Fender Stratocaster neck and I wouldn't be surprised if it looks very similar. I'm havign a hard time believing that this is the reason for the old Gibson necks breaking that easily. I find Gearhead's explanation of the shorter grain of the Mahogany far more plausible.
Bob-Dubery
deefstes wrote:
Has anyone ever heard of this technique actually breaking a neck? I've seen the technique being used many times and I always hear people express their doubtas as to how "safe" it is but I have yet to hear of anyone who's actually broken his guitar neck in the process.
Well it must be possible to damage the guitar doing this, but would require a non-trivial amount of force being applied and a general abandonment of common sense (or the knowledge that one has plenty of spare guitars at hand and the wherewithall to replenish stocks).
deefstes
deefstes wrote:
I'd like to see a similar cross section of a Fender Stratocaster neck and I wouldn't be surprised if it looks very similar.
I stand corrected, it doesn't look similar at all.
Telecaster top, Stratocaster bottom:
PeachyDragon
deefstes wrote:
deefstes wrote:
I'd like to see a similar cross section of a Fender Stratocaster neck and I wouldn't be surprised if it looks very similar.
I stand corrected, it doesn't look similar at all.
Telecaster top, Stratocaster bottom:
Awesome... I agree that this design is better but I don't like fender necks visually.
The grain on that Gibson is definitely a problem as well! I thought they would build the neck straight,
then break the neck joint and put it back at an angle after sanding etc... not just cut across the grain like that? :-S
Gearhead
PeachyDragon wrote:
I thought they would build the neck straight, then break the neck joint and put it back at an angle after sanding etc...
You're describing what is known as a scarf join. See my post above. It is more expensive to make, used on most upmarket acoustics for instance.
ezietsman
Look guys, its simple. LPs are the best sounding axes out there. With that great power comes the responsibility to NOT do neck bends and to NOT drop them. ?
AlanRatcliffe
ez wrote:
Look guys, its simple. LPs are the best sounding axes out there. With that great power comes the responsibility to NOT do neck bends and to NOT drop them. ?
Or put them in the stand too roughly... or look at them too hard...
I don't complain - that particular weakness paid my rent for more than ten years. ?
sean1
deefstes wrote:
Has anyone ever heard of this technique actually breaking a neck? I've seen the technique being used many times and I always hear people express their doubtas as to how "safe" it is but I have yet to hear of anyone who's actually broken his guitar neck in the process.
yes. in slash's autobiography he says one time he did this and the neck broke off, flipped up and did some damage to his face. i guess he considers it one of his signature things.
