piano, vocals and guitar (x2) in one recording. help 'samblief!

domhatch · 2011-06-20T14:38:32+00:00

ok, i have this song i recorded myself a long time ago with the following tracks (anything with an '*' means the part is not a live instrument; it's a sound...

piano, vocals and guitar (x2) in one recording. help 'samblief!

domhatch

howdy. i'm going to be rerecording everything from scratch, but i have to relearn the software (logic express) first along the way. thought i'd get some tips before i get too deep into the actual project. unfortunately, i seem to have lost just about everything to do with the original recording along the way, apart from the finished track itself. it's not a great song by any means, but hey, it's something, and that's better than nothing. i'm in a better environment, with better equipment, so i'm assuming it'll all come out better. with a little luck...

thanks
dh

Aleks

Have you tried Audacity?
It's an open-source (free) recording program.
It's pretty decent, I use it to record all my lil home projects and stuff, and it's pretty easy to use too.
You just record tracks over each other and then if you want, there's a bunch of cool effects and stuff.
I hope you come right!

Bob-Dubery

Did you record this originally with the vocals, guitars etc each on their own tracks and then mix down to stereo?

If so then do you have the original multi-track project?

Did you record with a click track?

AlanRatcliffe

If you don't have the source tracks, you are stuck rerecording everything.

If you have the Cakewalk project, you can export any MIDI and audio tracks and import them into Logic (chances you won't want to keep any of the audio, but they can be used as scratch tracks). Any MIDI tracks like drums or keys you can do whatever you want to once imported - edit the notes, use whatever softsynths you want, etc..

domhatch

i have audacity, but never thought of using it for multi-track projects.

the way i recorded the original was by (and settle in, this may take a while to explain):

- played the part on the kn1500
- adjusting where necessary in cakewalk (pitch, timing, etc)
- sending the cakewalk messages (midi i'm assuming) back to the keyboard and getting the line signal simultaneously from the keyboard (with a bit of lag i would also assume) back into the soundblaster
- each track recorded as a separate mono track, whether as described above or live direct into the soundblaster
- no click track
- there may have been a behringer mixer involved somewhere along the line, perhaps between the soundblaster and the line/live instruments.

see? basic, yet massively complicated. it was the only way i could see to getting the job done way back when.

i don't have the original project, or, rather, i don't have access to it... i have come to the realisation i will need to start from scratch. the equipment i have to hand is what is in my signature, plus an akg mic i used on the original recording - worked ok, apart from not being able to enhance the quality of my voice.

i'm thinking this is going to be a massive learning curve. my 'monitors' are going to be a newly-acquired set of marked-down yamaha msp5s. wish me luck!
dh

Warren

domhatch wrote:
i'm thinking this is going to be a massive learning curve. my 'monitors' are going to be a newly-acquired set of marked-down yamaha msp5s. wish me luck!
dh

I don't think it will be. Sounds like the older method you used was more complicated by far!

You have the UX1 interface which Logic should pick up quite happily. Do you still have the KN1500? If you do, you'll need a MIDI -> USB device to connect it to your Macbook so that Logic can pick it up as a MIDI device. They're not expensive.

From there it's easy: each track you create in Logic can be a software instrument (MIDI) or a real instrument (guitar through UX1). You can program the drums on a MIDI track too.

I'm assuming you're going to do the electric lead using the Pod Farm software that came with the UX1? If so, you should be able to choose the Pod Farm as a "modifier" (dunno what the proper term is) on the track you're recording the guitar on (it will be in the same list as all the standard Logic options, like Vocals / Drums etc.).

Aleks

You should take Alan's advice and really record with a click track.
Timing is one of the most important principles of music, and sometimes a song sounds GREAT just because it's sitting tight with the click.
Also, try not to rely to heavily on correcting pitch and timing with things like Auto-tune and a Quantizer.
Good luck!

domhatch

Aleks wrote: You should take Alan's advice and really record with a click track.
Timing is one of the most important principles of music, and sometimes a song sounds GREAT just because it's sitting tight with the click.
Also, try not to rely to heavily on correcting pitch and timing with things like Auto-tune and a Quantizer.
Good luck!

oh, abso-freakin-lutely. i do quantize a touch here and there, but i try to do it on a note-by-note basis, where something is way out of whack, rather than just putting a whole track back on, ahem, track. as far as pitch goes, i don't own an auto-tuner, i'd rather do another take! i think there may be a software one somewhere in my collection of plug-ins, but i'd rather just play the deck i've been dealt.

in terms of click tracks, i always record with a metronome going on in the background, i've just never laid down a specific click track for reference. this time, i will.

and warren, i do still have the kn1500, as well as a usb-midi interface, just haven't gotten around to sorting out how to get the keyboard-interface-laptop-software train rolling yet. and i agree, this process will be a lot less complicated, because i have better, simpler equipment, it's just a matter of learning how to put it all together. once i'm there in a month or so, i'll be rockin and rollin in the free world...

thanks for all the notes guys, i'll be trolling this board for some further tips and - hopefully before long - i'll be able to put up a before and after for y'all to listen to.

cheers
dh

Aleks

You mean trawling? ?
If you start trolling , admins might be at your doorstep. ?
Happy recording!

domhatch

good point...

Soundinmind

And here is the answer to what you been asking ?

When you record again and if you cant seperate the recordings and you need to do it all at once, use mic stands with blankets on them to try block off some of the sounds from the other instruments. Then use the microphone patterns to your advantage by placing them away from the other instruments. You'll find that the low end will always come through but the highs will be reduced and you may be able to do more with the tracks if you do it this way. Its not the best way but its how it used to be done in the day

domhatch

Soundinmind wrote: And here is the answer to what you been asking ?

When you record again and if you cant seperate the recordings and you need to do it all at once, use mic stands with blankets on them to try block off some of the sounds from the other instruments. Then use the microphone patterns to your advantage by placing them away from the other instruments. You'll find that the low end will always come through but the highs will be reduced and you may be able to do more with the tracks if you do it this way. Its not the best way but its how it used to be done in the day

thanks bud. i generally record a guide track - guitar and vocals with a click or drum, for instance - which i'll then use as a reference, and then lay down the others individually. so instrument separation isn't normally an issue, but if it ever is, i'll take this route - makes a lotta sense!

cheers
dh