Vocal/ amp set up for sessions?

flatfourfan

Myself and 3 other GFSA members have been playing together for a while and recently we decided to our hand at doing vocals because I get the distinct impression that ego's are to play here when trying out new vocalists.......lol.

Anyway, we're looking for a set up that can be used by the vocalist. At this stage we're just practising, but with a full band in a room, we're in need of a cost effective way to get some vocals added..........volume wise it has to stand up to an accoustic drum kit and guitars playing on volume 6 on 2 x (100watt hiwatt SS amps)

Any ideas? Amps? etc? Any advice?

AlanRatcliffe

No real way to get away without a PA IMO. 300 - 500W at least. Then you'll also have something for small gigs.

AlanRatcliffe

A lot of the powered PA speakers like the Wharfedale Titans and Proel Flash series also have a single mic input, so can be used by themselves as a small simple PA.

flatfourfan

hmmmmmmmmmmmm, we were hoping at maybe avoiding the PA route, but at the volume that we play it may be the best option. 2nd hand route will have to do for now as all my spare dosh is going into the room.

Jack-Flash-Jr

You will not regret getting a PA. A lot of live venues don't have ??? ??? ???
Plus, I don't lug my bass monster to practices, only to gigs, cause I just put it through the PA at practice volumes!

flatfourfan

Jack Flash Jr wrote: You will not regret getting a PA. A lot of live venues don't have ??? ??? ???
Plus, I don't lug my bass monster to practices, only to gigs, cause I just put it through the PA at practice volumes!

I don't think that we're even close to thinking about gigs at this stage, I'm kinda hoping that there's other option to get us over for the meantime.

flatfourfan

Just had a few links sent to me from a bud and it's nice to see that we can get something half decent for a few grand.

I saw the wharfdale one for R1800, but issues with the amp and only 200watt, seems to be a bit of a lost cause.

http://johannesburg.gumtree.co.za/c-Stuff-for-Sale-musical-instruments-Wharfedale-200w-Portable-PA-System-W0QQAdIdZ286610553

Guess it's time to save for something decent.

DonRoos

I have JBL EON Powered speakers that have a banance and unbalanced input with a mini mixer that has a 300Watt bass and 100Watt treble amp built in. This should keepup with the rest of the band. I have 2 so can chain them together if I really need to push.

We practice a lot softer with acoustic drums and cubes and for this I have just got a Laney Acoustic amp that has 2 chanels, one of which you can use for a mic and it pushes 35Watt. There is also a 65Watt version. It also has DI out so can be used as a monitor on stage.

IceCreamMan

Alan Ratcliffe wrote: No real way to get away without a PA IMO. 300 - 500W at least. Then you'll also have something for small gigs.

AAMOI , band i play in is looking crossing the threshold and acquiring a PA system preferably 2nd hand but otherwise new with the view of doing smallish gigs in pubs and birthdays etc. This you describe above, what sort of realistic costs are we looking at?

Thanks

AlanRatcliffe

Entry level (for me at least) is about R20K retail (R16 - 17K street). That's the Proel Flash 12A powered speakers and the Proel 16 channel desk. You could easily sub in the Yamaha 16 channel MX-series desk (gaining six channels of simple compression) and/or the Wharfedale Titan Actives (I wasn't wild about the mid scoop on the Titans and, being in Cape Town, I've been bitten by Yamaha's "backup" before).

Many people could easily scale down to an eight channel desk without noticing, but the Proel and Yammy 16 channel desks have nice feature sets that will also cover you in nearly every situation and are both surprisingly cheap. For a band, I always look at scalability, which is prime importance when you are putting together a PA (today small pubs, tomorrow...), and with both speaker systems, you can also upgrade later, simply by adding on the equivalent subs.

The Yamaha Stagepas 500 is another option in the same kind of price range. Eminently compact and portable, but doesn't have anywhere near the low end extension or features.

Moving up from there (if you can afford it), a Mackie desk and a pair of JBL EONs. Sure, they are more expensive, but in sound reinforcement you get what you pay for. Up from there, an Allen and Heath desk and some of the bigger JBLs.

slyd

Keep an eye out for Music shops that usually have once-a-year sales, and get there. I know sometimes they mark up the "normal" price before putting on the sale price, but, IMO you can really get a good deal.
Our percussionist bought a 12 channel Mackie desk, with all the trimmings, plus 2 x powered Mackie 400w (i think) bins, for 11k, at one of Dbn's shop's annual sale last year. I've been working with PA's for many, many years, and I am very impressed with it.
A PA is a must, even for just a jam band. :?

flatfourfan

Looks like we're going to be going with this.

Yamaha Pro Audio Stage PAS300

Got a local shop that will do a killer deal on one that is about R3000 cheaper than list price after discount. After asking around and checking with people in the know, the PAS500 would of been great, but I can't justify that type of coin right now.

Features:
• Two passive speakers with built-in powered mixer Speaker cables (5 m x 2)
• Two-way bass reflex speakers suitable as mains or monitors
• Eight channel powered mixer
• Four mic + Two stereo line inputs
• Class D power amplifier (150w + 150W)
• One-bit modulation digital reverb
• Mic stand mountable mixer (with optional BMS10A)
• Built-in reverb for the four mic/line channels, with a master send control

Specs:
• Maximum Output Power 150 W+150 W/6O @ 10% THD at 1kHz (SPEAKER L/R)
• Frequency Response -3 dB, 0 dB, +1 dB @20 Hz.20 kHz, 1 W Output/6O (SPEAKER L/R)
• Total Harmonic Distortion 1% @1 kHz, 50 W Output Power (SPEAKER L/R)
• Hum & Noise -65 dBu Residual output noise (SPEAKER L/R)
• Weight 18 kg (mixer and two speakers)
• Power Consumption 70 W
• Stereo Input channel Equalization: Shelving turnover/rolloff frequency: 3 dB before maximum cut or boost ± 15 dB, HIGH 10 kHz shelving, LOW 100 Hz shelving
• Speaker Unit LF: 8" Cone; HF: 1" Compression Driver
• Cross Over Frequency: 4 kHz
• Frequency Range: 55 Hz - 20 kHz
• Maximum Output Level: 112 dB (1 m)

Jacquesg4j

One thing I've seen also... Don't buy cheap mics! They won't get you anywhere. We had some Samson mics that weren't too expensive that did the trick. These Joseph mics that stores are selling are utter crap!

Jack-Flash-Jr

Jacquesg4j wrote: One thing I've seen also... Don't buy cheap mics! They won't get you anywhere. We had some Samson mics that weren't too expensive that did the trick. These Joseph mics that stores are selling are utter crap!

+1 We always bring our own mics to gigs even if the venue provides. Not only is the quality generally not great but the guys on vox tend to get to know their mics as well...

Jacquesg4j

The other day I was at a gig where Joe Niemand also performed... He brought his own digital desk and without needing to sound check for too long, his sound was great! It seems like the way to go... Carry your own digidesk to gigs with your settings already saved!

DonRoos

Jack Flash Jr wrote:
Jacquesg4j wrote: One thing I've seen also... Don't buy cheap mics! They won't get you anywhere. We had some Samson mics that weren't too expensive that did the trick. These Joseph mics that stores are selling are utter crap!
+1 We always bring our own mics to gigs even if the venue provides. Not only is the quality generally not great but the guys on vox tend to get to know their mics as well...

+1 I hate to think what must be lurking in publicly used mics! I shudder at the thought. I got ill once when I did not use my own mic. Lesson learned.

flatfourfan

Jacquesg4j wrote: One thing I've seen also... Don't buy cheap mics! They won't get you anywhere. We had some Samson mics that weren't too expensive that did the trick. These Joseph mics that stores are selling are utter crap!

That's next on the list as well as a decent mic stand. I may just splurge out and get a hercules one as they don't make any crap products. Just pricey.

Reckon it's worth it looking at the second hand market for mics?