Vintage-Vibe
Hi guys:
Having worked at Bothners for over 5 years before I left, (as a guitar specialist) I can tell you the following:
- +1 to Alan - pay peanuts, get monkeys.
- at Spur Steak Ranches you have to do an "exam/test" before you can officially work on their floor - no such system exists for shops that specialise in musical equipment?!
- Everyone has good and bad days at work, you and I included.
- People that protest the loudest usually know the least.
- I shop at MusiekWereld, Marshall & Bothners - I have had great and less than great experiences at all shops
- I agree with sussing out a salesperson you haven't dealt with before with a few leading questions - let them reveal what they know (also know that certain issues like guitar brand loyalty are a matter of taste, not expertise). At the same time, if you go into a shop and ask the salesman a question then proceed to tell him why his answer is wrong, he's going to think "well f*** you too buddy" to himself - salesman just don't get paid enough to care usually. There's sometimes too much ego involved in gear chats at these shops - people are too defensive about proving how much they know.
- Try & see how many salesman stop and ask you "What do YOU think?" - "What are YOUR needs/tastes?" - that's the sign of a good salesman.
- NEVER be scared to approach a salesperson - he/she is there to help However, if they ignore you or give you the cold shoulder don't feel bad to ask for the manager and tell him politely that no-one seems to want to help. Salesman often stand around for HOURS in dead spots in the day - u would think that when a customer finally arrives they would be thrilled, but often the OPPOSITE is true - they try and avoid you, or see you as an interruption to whatever they were doing before you arrived. (Idle time isn't good 4 the brain ) If someone treats you that way take your business to another salesman - if you get the same problem go to another shop
- The manager can't improve the service of his shop if dissatisfied customers don't lodge their complaints - it's a big problem in the service industry in this country - just look at restaurants
4 me personally - these are the HELPFUL guys at each shop (and remember 1 guy may be helpful and know less, whereas another might not know as much, but go out of his way to help)
(SORRY - THIS IS ALL Cape Town BASED )
Musiek Wereld:
Vissie (owner - when you can catch him he's a whirlwind of activity - heart of gold)
Kobus (also a great guy - a bit younger so obviously more accessable 4 teens, 20-somethings)
Paul Bothner Music PLUMSTEAD:
Warren - really helpful - not a tech-head, but goes out of his way
Edgar - for bass-related issues
Warwick - teaches as well, so he's only in on certain days and times - big guy - hard to miss - best up to date technical knowledge of the lot (in his early 20's)
BTW - Kyle Petersen: IMO is the best keyboard Salesman in CT - hot player too with lots of technical knowhow - especially with Roland products.
Jerome Da Silva - assistant manager the best and most knowledgable drum salesman in the country hands down.
Marshall Music CT:
Mike - owner nice guy, obviously a busy man.
Graham - manager - guitar guy - great manner with customers
Dave - can be a bit zealous at times, but he's learning to calm down lately, and he makes an effort to learn his products - one of the best salesman in CT in terms of how much business he does.
Hope this helps
Have a good weekend
ralley
Another thumbs up for Music Mate in Zambezi, when I was looking around for my Line6 Toneport UX-1 I rang around every music store in Johburg - everyone was "no we don't stock those" or "out of stock". Not one store offered to try and source one or offered an alternative. I rang Zambezi and the guy said they were out of stock but to give him my number and he would call back. I gave my number expecting to never hear back. Within 5 minutes he called back - couldn't get hold of a UX-1 but offering me a UX-2 at an excellent price. They called back within a couple of days when it arrived in stock and even stayed open whilst I battled the traffic from Midrand. Months later I was back in just browsing around and he greated me and asked after the Toneport despite only having met me for about 2 minutes total - very impressed, they won me as a customer for life (till I moved to NZ!)
At the other end of the spectrum I took my strat in to Andy McGibbons for a set-up, cost an absolute fortune, took weeks longer than promised (despite being pre booked) and the set up was a joke. Came back with fillings stuck to the pole pieces, buzzing worse than before and the trem still hanging up on a mis cut scratch plate. They had been explicitly asked to look at tuning stability with the trem, they had obviously never even tried it. Got myself some feeler gauges, tweaked the truss rod and adjusted the action and had it playing infinetly better in half an hour. I never took them up on this because I got it back just before Christmas, wish I had. When I took it in I spoke directly to a tech who seemed knowledgable, I suspect in the rush they just got some bozo shop monkey to do the work.
Rob.
trungboyshigh
A few months ago,i was shopping around for a guitar amp.After friendly assistance over the phone,I decided to visit the Marshall Woodmead store n my experience proved to b quite diff from what i had expected.Lookin around the guitars n amps section (n was very impressed by their range of products n store layout), having found noone to help me,i wandered into the drums section n was approached by one of the drum specialists.i told him i was lookin for a guitar amp,which he mockingly replied "this is the drums section man,guitar amps r not round shaped n they have speakers on them" he eventually showed me to a guitar specialist who gave me some good advice, but that really put a sour grape in what wouldve been a pleasant experience with Marshall Woodmead for me.After that I went to a few other smaller music stores (Lovemore music, the Shops in Brooklyn n Atterbury value mart Pta) and found their customer service to be much higher
Carel
Alan Ratcliff is the one who got me addicted to this forum…
As such it would be your prerogative to forward any complaints regarding my presence and comments to him. (Sorry Alan but you have me addicted.)
Although this might well jeopardize my comments and presence, I decided to come straight out and introduce myself.
Other them some of my “friends” in the industry I am using my own name and coming clear about who and what I am.
To put it bluntly – I am not using an alias so as to confuse you and lull you into a state of complacency where you might think I am a mere fellow enthusiast, when what they are actually hoping to do is move you some gear in a subliminal level through suggestive selling.
I suspect I will be shut down / kicked out shortly, but this would however be to our collective loss.
Right, yes wait for it:
My name is Carel van Heerden and I am the one responsible for Paul Bothner Music’s stores.
I need to thank you all for your most valuable inputs.
It is incredibly insightful and I will certainly be incorporating it in future training modules.
AlanRatcliffe
Hi Carel - welcome to the forum
I suspect I will be shut down / kicked out shortly
On the contrary - we are glad to have your input here. If you refer to the
rules of the forum, all you have to do is state your affiliations in your signature and refrain from specifically advertising your stores or products in your posts.
I'm pretty sure that you will take any criticism you find here and use it constructively, and I'm equally sure the guys will like having someone to direct any complaints to if they are unhappy.
I'm hoping that other individuals from the other retailers follow suit and join in so that we can work together to improve the quality standards in the industry as a whole.
Riaan-Combrink
Hi Carel.
Like Alan, I for one welcome your presence here at GFSA. The idea with this forum is surely to be a hub to discuss guitar and music through the whole spectrum (players, technique, gear, etc). We often wonder about industry related things, and who better to hear it from?
Enjoy the forum! ?
Renesongs
Welcome Carel - I hope you visit us frequently and give us your views from time to time. I'm sure you won't need to fall foul of our forum rules because Alan seems to do much of the promo for Bothners ? (and Norio seems to favour Marshall, so all's fair in love money and music ?)
I'm hoping that other individuals from the other retailers follow suit and join in so that we can work together to improve the quality standards in the industry as a whole.
+++1
@ VV +1 Edgar is THE man to talk to about bass . I have a good relationship with Dave from Marshall he always gives me the feeling that I know best and he is there to show you what they got in stock - I kind of like that approach ?
NorioDS
Renesongs wrote:Norio seems to favour Marshall
I might actually support Bothner's if there was one in PTA. The JV Music place here in Centurion has horrible service. The co-owner has serious attitude but Moose is an awesome guy. Their prices are just a bit high for my tastes.
Short of going into Braamfontein to visit TOMS, Marshall is the only decent place up here that stocks a wide range of things at good prices.
I'm happy to be proven wrong! I hate travelling so far just to get my gear!
Manfred-Klose
Cool, now that we can be honest about music shops this i what i think.
1. Musiek Wereld
They are too over priced.
They cater for a more old school clients.
Conclusion: Not my favourite shop, but still go there sometimes.
Rating:5/10
2.Music Mate
I buy most of my gear from them, and they giving away great deals.
they lack some knowledge about high end gear.
Conclusion:They are friendly young people, that are also musos, i've been to the shops goerge,centurion,cape town, and all of them pretty much live up to their name.
Rating:7/10
3.Marshall Music
I only recently been to marshall music in cape town, they pretty much have stock of everything, the guys are friendly, and give quotes within a matter of seconds that they get from a application on there cellphone, thats awesome. They are very honest about the products they sell, they gave me some tips on studio related stuff.
Conclusion:While i was there within 2 seconds someone helped me, when i asked a question he couldn't answer the
sales person called someone with more experience in that field, and my problem was solved.
Some of there stuff is a bit over priced, but they also have some great bargain if buy a lot of gear.
Rating:8/10
4.Paul Bother
They are also a great shop, although the one in goodwood is very small and get a bit crowded on saturdays, and the one in plumstead has got every guitar you ever wanted, what a dream.
There customer service lacks some detail. sometimes you have to ask someone to help you, i useally just talk to the manager if i want help.
Conlcusion:They can be compared to marshall music, altough the shops a cape town is a laidback and everyone is on a permanent vacation if you got job there.
Rating:7/10
do let me get started on musicfest.........
Bane
Dave and Graham from Marshall Music are nice guys and seem to know what they are talking about. And they often end our conversations with "but give it a try and see for yourself" rather than 'it's the best, take it". No matter how much your salesman knows, buying gear is a personal thing and staff members should always encourage you to try more than just one guitar, pedal etc to make sure you walk out happy. You can google gear as much as you want but you need to FEEL it to know what you are buying. If you get feeling a salesman doesn''t have time for you, walk out.
dee
Manfred Klose wrote:
Cool, now that we can be honest about music shops this i what i think.
O nice. I was actually going to suggest that we review each shop, and give a description of what they stock, other than the usual brands.
WantzChas
Hi, I'm new on this forum. So happy to have found a local forum. Got tired of convering from $ and £.
Norio wrote:
I might actually support Bothner's if there was one in PTA. The JV Music place here in Centurion has horrible service. The co-owner has serious attitude but Moose is an awesome guy. Their prices are just a bit high for my tastes.
I agree. They're probably hands down the worst music store I've ever been to. Prices, help, afdvice are all just pathetic. The guy that works at
Lovemore is awesome. He knows everything about everything. I shop at Lovemore and Marshal Woodmead.
NorioDS
The one guy I spoke to at Centurion Lovemore is ridiculous. He's the genius that reckons that all Ibanez guitars are entry-level guitars and not worth buying.
He seems to know who Satriani and Vai are but I think he just knows OF them because clearly he can't know too much about them if he has that opinion of Ibanez. I took him as the sort of guy that likes to appear like he knows everything but actually knows just enough to be dangerous to himself and others.
Not sure of his name, sorry.
Manfred-Klose
Out of the very few times i've been in PTA i actually went to the lovemore shop
I wouldn't call it a guitarshop, more like a piano, 2 drumsets and some acoustic guitar shop.
If they follow in the footsteps of marshall music,Paul botners and music mate...............those are the only shops i will support!!!
NorioDS
+1 Manfred although I think they consider themselves superior because of their BA in music. The guy I spoke to said it was a requirement to work there. Which, actually, is a good thing and helps them know a lot about oboes, pianos, etc, but maybe guitar is a bit too alternative for them??? ?
AlanRatcliffe
Norio wrote:
+1 Manfred although I think they consider themselves superior because of their BA in music. The guy I spoke to said it was a requirement to work there. Which, actually, is a good thing and helps them know a lot about oboes, pianos, etc, but maybe guitar is a bit too alternative for them??? ?
They're obviously catering for a different market. Conversely orchestral instrument players are frequently unhappy with the lack of knowledge of their instruments they encounter in the music stores we frequent. If they asked you who was better, Menuhin or Perlman, would you have much of an idea?
Having said that... a degree in music is not necessarily indicative of any knowledge of the instruments themselves, much as being able to shred doesn't mean a guitarist will make a good salesman at Bothner's or Marshall's. ? I wouldn't be able to get a job there. ☹
NorioDS
Alan Ratcliffe wrote:If they asked you who was better, Menuhin or Perlman, would you have much of an idea?
Nope but nor would I act like I did. I would try refer the guy to someone who DID know or at least find out the answer to a specific question he might have, etc.
It's not the not-knowing that irritates me. Never has been. It's the "I don't know but I'll share my opinion with you as if it were the absolute truth and as if you're stupid for not listening to me" attitude that gets me. Heck even if you DO know your stuff, each person is different so how about first finding out what the guy's interests/influences are before making a suggestion?
AlanRatcliffe
It's the "I don't know but I'll share my opinion with you as if it were the absolute truth and as if you're stupid for not listening to me"
Ah, the type who doesn't know his A-hole from his F-hole and is completely fixated on only one style of music - I've known a few of those. Worse are the ones who, if they don't know something, make up something on the spot.
CornFlakes
I went to Marshall this weekend with my “Bass problem” and as I walk in the “guy” that gave bad service last time was standing at the door greeting me with “hi can I help you” tried to dodge him but didn’t work! Well then I thought to myself let’s give him another chance but was disappointed.
I’m not going to go into what happened but what I’m trying to say is that was the last time I’m going to go to MARSHALL MUSIC!
Heath
Stewart @ marshall is a pleasure to deal with knows his equipment , and rather friendly as well .... just my 2 cents worth . was there on friday when buying stuff they always good , just don't send you guitar there that they will screw up thou ..... andy mc gibbons is the guy you send you guitar to .
