Looking at buying a new Camera

Squonk

http://www.sacamera.co.za/product/1011698/Nikon_D3X_Body_Only/

Thank goodness GAS is cheap ?

RobK

For that kind of money, I suspect you could fly to New York, go visit B&H Photo, buy the camera, have a nice weekend and still come back with change ?

Tonedef

Squonk wrote http://www.sacamera.co.za/product/1011698/Nikon_D3X_Body_Only/

Thank goodness GAS is cheap ?

And to think that somewhere out there on the intarweb, there's a bunch of celluloid anoraks arguing about the merits of this exact camera! ?

Bob-Dubery

Well I got one when I went over to the UK last year.

The problem I find with many digital cameras, but maybe I keep on making bad choices, is that there's a lag between you pushing the button and the camera actually doing anything useful like taking the position.

EG you're at the concert and Satch strikes this great pose and so you point and click

Then 20 seconds later the camera decides to do something, by which time reality has moved on and Satch is now picking his nose whilst the drummer takes a solo.

So you don't get the shot you want or expect.

This maybe something to do with the program or options that you select. Maybe there's a way to by-pass all the automatic focussing and adjusting for light etc etc

Squonk

Just found a lens for the camera
http://www.sacamera.co.za/product/1011933/Nikon_600mm_f4G_AFS_VR_IFED_Lens/

The price at B&H $7500
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/592951-REG/Nikon_25442_D3x_SLR_Digital_Camera.html

RobK

X-rated Bob wrote

The problem I find with many digital cameras, but maybe I keep on making bad choices, is that there's a lag between you pushing the button and the camera actually doing anything useful like taking the position.

It's called shutter lag, and the cheaper the camera the worse the lag. Nothing you can do about it - it's not a setting. I'd be a bit upset if that R 73 000 camera had any lag.

RobK

Squonk wrote Just found a lens for the camera
http://www.sacamera.co.za/product/1011933/Nikon_600mm_f4G_AFS_VR_IFED_Lens/

The price at B&H $75000
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/592951-REG/Nikon_25442_D3x_SLR_Digital_Camera.html

I suspect you mean $7500. You could most probably get a discount on that, so maybe looking at R 45000, which means R30 000 left for flights, accomodation and spending money.

Of course, you may have to pay VAT and duties when you come back.

The price of that lens has gone down a bit. Used to be able to find it at around the R 120 000 mark.

Tonedef

X-rated Bob wrote Well I got one when I went over to the UK last year.

The problem I find with many digital cameras, but maybe I keep on making bad choices, is that there's a lag between you pushing the button and the camera actually doing anything useful like taking the position.

EG you're at the concert and Satch strikes this great pose and so you point and click

Then 20 seconds later the camera decides to do something, by which time reality has moved on and Satch is now picking his nose whilst the drummer takes a solo.

So you don't get the shot you want or expect.

This maybe something to do with the program or options that you select. Maybe there's a way to by-pass all the automatic focussing and adjusting for light etc etc

It's got to do with iso levels and whatnot. The CCD is similar to traditional film in that it needs a certain amount of exposure to read the image. The problem with CCDs, especially in high-contrast, low-light conditions is that the CCD suffers from overexposure very easily, so it needs to analyse each individual pixel in real time to determine the correct brightness and chromaticity for it so that that pixel looks correct in the context of the entire image.

I'm not an expert, but the advent of mik-en-druk digital cameras didn't make life any easier for photographers in the sense of getting a good shot.

RobK

Tonedef wrote
X-rated Bob wrote Well I got one when I went over to the UK last year.

The problem I find with many digital cameras, but maybe I keep on making bad choices, is that there's a lag between you pushing the button and the camera actually doing anything useful like taking the position.

EG you're at the concert and Satch strikes this great pose and so you point and click

Then 20 seconds later the camera decides to do something, by which time reality has moved on and Satch is now picking his nose whilst the drummer takes a solo.

So you don't get the shot you want or expect.

This maybe something to do with the program or options that you select. Maybe there's a way to by-pass all the automatic focussing and adjusting for light etc etc

It's got to do with iso levels and whatnot. The CCD is similar to traditional film in that it needs a certain amount of exposure to read the image. The problem with CCDs, especially in high-contrast, low-light conditions is that the CCD suffers from overexposure very easily, so it needs to analyse each individual pixel in real time to determine the correct brightness and chromaticity for it so that that pixel looks correct in the context of the entire image.

I'm not an expert, but the advent of mik-en-druk digital cameras didn't make life any easier for photographers in the sense of getting a good shot.

Nope, pretty much sure it's plain ol' shutter lag. Doesn't matter what the ISO is. Higher ISO will help with getting a less blurrier pic in low light. What you can try do is get focus lock before you press the shutter completely - that way everything is already "locked in" when you do push the shutter all the way. Might help, might not. My solution is, still, to buy a better camera ?

aubs1

RobK wrote Nope, pretty much sure it's plain ol' shutter lag. Doesn't matter what the ISO is. Higher ISO will help with getting a less blurrier pic in low light. What you can try do is get focus lock before you press the shutter completely - that way everything is already "locked in" when you do push the shutter all the way. Might help, might not. My solution is, still, to buy a better camera ?

Correct RobK...... higher end cameras, less lag. I've two Nikon D200s for a few years now, and my AF lenses are like lightning fast, and virtually zero shutter lag! So the better the model, you should not have any noticeable lag......

But with "mik and druk", a different story. I have a Fuji Finepix HS10 which we use for holidays, etc, which does have half second lag on single frame shots, but I've learnt to deal with that. And I'm happy with my pics..

Tonedef

From Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutter_lag

Digital cameras
Shutter lag is much more of a problem with digital cameras. In digital cameras, the delay results from the charging of the CCD and relatively slow transmission of its capture data to the circuitry of the camera for processing and storage. Recent improvements in technology, however, such as the speed, bandwidth and power consumption of processor chips and memory, as well as CCD technology, have made shutter lag less of a problem. As of 2007, the greatest advancements have been limited mostly to professional, "prosumer," and high-end consumer-grade digital cameras. Inexpensive (most "point-and-shoot") digital cameras, however, have even reduced the average shutter lag to half seconds, and higher-end "point-and-shoot" cameras have reduced this down to a quarter second or less.

Make of that what you will, it mirrors my understanding of how CCDs work, but Wikipedia is by no means the holy grail of truth.

Squonk

Aubs1 wrote
But with "mik and druk", a different story. I have a Fuji Finepix HS10 which we use for holidays, etc, which does have half second lag on single frame shots, but I've learnt to deal with that. And I'm happy with my pics..

How is this Camera Aubs, just bought my Wife one, A kind of Bridging Camera? with some SLR functionality, seemed to have higher spec than the Nikon and Canon equivalent, also the Manual Zoom sold it for us.

singemonkey

It's not just price. All compact digital cameras suffer from shutter-lag. For the past 3 years, all digital SLRs have not. It's to do with the mechanism of operation. You simply cannot buy a compact that doesn't have shutter-lag. In compensation they are considerably easier to carry about.

The D3X has been argued as extremely overpriced. But since it's only a particularly useful camera to a very small proportion of photographers, they can pretty much charge whatever they want. It's a niche camera. Most people who want high resolution will buy the much cheaper canon, or the Sony if they're on a budget. Most people who want fast operation will go for the Nikon D3 - which shoots much faster with a resolution that is far more than sufficient for a double page spread in a magazine and top of the line low-light capability for being able to jack up the shutter speed in low light - something that's essential for sports photographers.

The SA price there is not terrible. When I import from B&H, I usually charge myself R10/$US. This takes into account shipping and duties and is usually about right. Frequently it ends up still being dramatically cheaper than buying locally (usually about 65% of the SA price in my past experience). But I suspect with the D3X even SA retail is wise to the fact that no one in their right mind will consider buying at double such an inflated price.

So no. At $7,600 it would not be cheaper to fly to NYC and pick one up ?

RobK

singemonkey wrote

So no. At $7,600 it would not be cheaper to fly to NYC and pick one up ?

Maybe not cheaper in the end, but a lot more fun than ordering online locally. ?

guitarboy2828

http://www.sacamera.co.za/product/1012057/Sigma_200500mm_F2.8_APO_EX_DG_for_Nikon/ The lens to go with it! ?

I've actually been thinking of starting a topic on getting a new camera as I'm pretty close to getting one... I know there are some guys on the forum that know a good fair deal about cameras, so would like their input.. So i'm going to steal squonks topic for a sec! ?

Right now it's a toss up between the 550D and 60D. Considered the 7D, but it's just too much for me right now, not sure I could justify that camera. I see there is a 600D coming out, but from what I've read it's nothing spectacular. Obviously a big difference between 60D and 550D, but is it worth the extra moola? I need the video function (or i should say i really would like the video function). Otherwise, some sports photography, some landscape, nothing specific. It's for church, so it's very multi purpose.

Opinions?

AndrewD

Anything that is that "High-end" in any application (music included) comes with a massive price tag.

Do a search for high-end broadcast video cameras for eg - makes the stills cameras look like a drop in the ocean.

aubs1

Squonk wrote How is this Camera Aubs, just bought my Wife one, A kind of Bridging Camera? with some SLR functionality, seemed to have higher spec than the Nikon and Canon equivalent, also the Manual Zoom sold it for us.

I saw a few weeks back that you bought the same one, quite a nifty little camera, I think. Takes a bit of getting used to..... one that your lady can learn a lot with ...... What I like about Fujis is that they render much nicer skin-tones than other cameras. I like the 30X optical zoom. I agree with a review that I read that above 400ASA the image is not so lekker, but for what I shoot I will not be printing larger than A4 for my kids anyway, and Leani has software that can do a bit of enhancements (which she enjoys) ....... I would say yes, a good bridging camera .......push it to it's limits ....

RobK

guitarboy2828 wrote http://www.sacamera.co.za/product/1012057/Sigma_200500mm_F2.8_APO_EX_DG_for_Nikon/ The lens to go with it! ?

I've actually been thinking of starting a topic on getting a new camera as I'm pretty close to getting one... I know there are some guys on the forum that know a good fair deal about cameras, so would like their input.. So i'm going to steal squonks topic for a sec! ?

Right now it's a toss up between the 550D and 60D. Considered the 7D, but it's just too much for me right now, not sure I could justify that camera. I see there is a 600D coming out, but from what I've read it's nothing spectacular. Obviously a big difference between 60D and 550D, but is it worth the extra moola? I need the video function (or i should say i really would like the video function). Otherwise, some sports photography, some landscape, nothing specific. It's for church, so it's very multi purpose.

Opinions?

It's been a long while since I last bought an SLR - these days I have a digicam which serves my needs. However, I reccomend you go do some reading at www.dpreview.com . They usually have very indepth reviews, with high quality samples that will help you decide.

prince

Like Rob says dpreview.com is the place to go before spending your money on a camera.

I used to take photos of offroad motorcycle racing, a compact fits nicely into your bag but with the "shutter lag" I was lucky if I got the back mudguard in the photo while a dslr worked perfectly but was a schlep to cart around on the bike. And then get trashed in the dust, mud and rain

To reduce the "shutter lag" you can aim at the point where you think all the settings (light/focus/distance etc) will be the same as where you want to take your photo, depress the shutter button halfway and hold it there, then when Satch (in XRated Bob's example) strikes his pose the cameras "reaction time" is much less. With a bit of practice you can get much closer to the shot you want but a dslr (especially at R70k) will be much better than a R1500 point and shoot.

Also, the Nikon D3X at R74k is for the body only. Decent lenses will start at maybe a little less and go up to probably double the cost of the body. The body also has a useful life, I think it was about 100,000 or 200,000 shots (I could be wrong on how many it was). If you take 5,000 shots in a weekend R74k doesn't go a long way.

If you are shocked by the price of the camera, on SA Camera take a look at a Canon Lens Hood for an ET120B, R7,800 for a piece of plastic.

Compared to Photography and offroad bikes, guitars are a pleasure price wise and on how long they are going to last.

RobK

I think cameras like the D3X are really meant for photographers who actually need a camera to make money and also not to fail at a critical moment - National Geographic photographers come to mind. That or people who have way too much money and haven't heard of guitars yet ?