Niel-Roos
Hey guys. This is my first post and I have to say that I am quite stoked to have found such and awesome local guitar forum. Something I've needed for help and inspiration for so long. Before I registered I have read through a few of the threads and I have to say, there is so much valuable info on this site!
I hope my question fits with this topic. Anyway, let's cut to the chase. I have an ESP LTD Viper-500 with very nice pickups suited for my metal/hard-rock sounding band. We are doing an Alter Bridge type of sound and I am quite the Tremonti fan. I bought this guitar with a thick gauge and I realized it limits me with speed somewhat. The action has to be high as well with the thicker strings and that limits me as well.
I want to play fast licks, but not loose too much of my nice thick tone (9's aren't an option). I would like you guys to give me an opinion on playing fast with thick gauge strings and what brand and gauge you would recommend for my style. I am also into blues and I try to fit that into my solos as well. Hence my other guitar being a Fender Strat.
Thanks
Niel
Vintage-Vibe
Hi Niel
Welcome !
Luckily the guitar doesn't have a floating bridge.
You need to consider the LOWEST tuning you''ll be using.
If that's Drop D in Standard (DADGBE), a set of 9 to 42 or 10 to 46 Nickel wound electric strings is best - every time you tune all the stringd down a semitone (eg E down to Eb etc ...) you should theoretically go UP 1 gauge (eg from 9s to 10s)
The setting of the bridge, and especially adjustment of the neck should be done by a pro with experience.
If you r in CT I would be happy to do the setup (part of my work), otherwise we can always refer you to someone good in your area !
VV
Niel-Roos
I had an old guitar which I used to mess around with and practice setting up the bridge, intonation etc. But yeah, this is a pretty new guitar and I am pretty scared of even trying to mess around with this one. I live in the Northern suburbs, so can you send me an email so we can meet up and choose a gauge and set up the guitar.
Thanks!
Bane
Hmmm...well my axe's nut limited me to 11s, because the 12gauge G string didnt fit, so i modified it. I love 12's, simply because they feel heavy and solid. The gauge of a string doesnt bother me in terms of speed so i say choose a gauge that feels right to you and stick to it. As for action mine is as low is possible with minimal fret noise, I like it low. Unfortunatley i can't tune my axe to standard E cause the tension is too great but thats where a pitchshifter comes in ? i prefer standard D but have gone to standard B without a problem. My point...choose a gauge and action that you feel comfortable with and build speed on that. ?
deanBailey
hehe I use 13-56 and managed to Get to E ? although it did increase the tension which meant poopy bends.
But after I got my guitar professionally setup where they filed my nut to fit the gauge it felt SO smooth ?
Vintage-Vibe
Hi Niel
I am based in S Suburbs Kenilworth.
Normally I need 2 to 3 days at most for a full setup.
R 300.00 plus strings will get you full restring, neck adjustment, intonation & action set and a general cleanup if necessary)
You can get me on: gazATaxepertiseDOTcoDOTza
Lets discuss gauge by mail before you bring guitar through if poss.
Saves time
VV
Bane
13!!! hectic. yeah it's playable but getting those whole-step bends are HARD and a whole-half step near impossible.
Martyr
13's are quite crazy...i use 10-46,i play drop D tuning....
deanBailey
I know, I NEED thicker strings because I just taught myself to pick really hard as I play with very low gain (so I can hear every note I play), Regardless of the genre, be it death metal or prog rock I play with my gain on my OD channel on 3 with the OD pedal on:
Drive off
tone off
Level 100% (I'll explain this later if anyone is interested)
So I'm in control of the everything.
It's the whole clarity vs gain thing.
But with low gain, your playing (for metal) WILL sound sound pretty wimpy if you pick soft. Most guitarist rely on High Gain Tone for the playing style because they're (no offense) too lazy to pick harder (Especially those with Passives) which imo is incorrect regarding High Gain tone, and turn the gain up to compensate for their playing.
Before I go off topic...
...The reason I pick harder is because I don't rely on the amount of gain to make my playing sound heavy. If I pick harder it makes peaks of the guitar signal clip the input harder which creates more natural OD. AND it makes your playing sound more brutal (by brutal I don't mean genre) Steve Vai picks really hard too judging from his DVD.
Tip: More gain doesn't mean more heavier guitar tone, it means messier tone.
Also the more gain you add the more compressed the signal gets (which is the reason High gain is sweet for leads if anyone didn't know ?).
Sorry if I insulted anyones, intelligence.
Edit: I play in D standard and Drop C (for The Horror Cast) on my King V now btw, I was just messing around in E standard.
Bane
Dead on Dean (hehe say that out loud ☹), there is a terrible rumour going around that more gain is brutal. I get it, but one does lose clarity when using a distortion patch and pumping the gain. I pump my lead with gain though (say 6+- /10) because i use a mild overdrive for my lead tone.
deanBailey
Oh shit, I also forgot to say that there is a limit to picking hard. I've had clients that picked really soft during palm mutes and really loud during un-muted notes (especially the open hangs). Where it should actually be the opposite!
With palm mutes your notes are dead (duh) so you'd want to pick hard to liven them up a bit (unless you're going for dynamics) With the open notes when he plucked really hard it pushed the note waaaay to sharp.
Thats a problem I see most bassists do, Is really pluck the shit out of their strings and you can see the string vibrating quite heavily lol which makes the notes to sharp.
Martyr
i actually stopped picking so hard because i was breaking strings regularly(like every 2weeks)...i pick relatively hard still so i don't have to use so much gain(mines at about just over half way on my pedal,i play through my clean channel)...i didn't want to upgrade to thicker strings because i didn't think it would be wise(seeing i'm not playing outside E standard and drop D)...
i get what you saying about the messy part,i know alot of guitarists who crank their gain full and it sounds messy as hell!!!
but still 13s are crazy!!!!! ?
deanBailey
LOL I see at least 2-3 guitarist at EVERY show I play that do that and they shout at the engineer because there's too much feedback.
Niel-Roos
Ahoy Dean! Thanks for your input!
I think I might just stay with my gauge if you can cope with 13's. Do you use a tube screamer and can you please explain that 100% Level? How low can you get those 13's or is it too thick nwayz to give too much buzz?
Thanks!
deanBailey
Niel Roos wrote
Ahoy Dean! Thanks for your input!
I think I might just stay with my gauge if you can cope with 13's. Do you use a tube screamer and can you please explain that 100% Level? How low can you get those 13's or is it too thick nwayz to give too much buzz?
Thanks!
No problem ?
Yes, in The Horror Cast we only use overdrive with no cleans so I use the Maxon OD820 into my OD channel of my amp. The tube screamer just alters the sound of the guitar input before it enters the amp so you're clipping a similar but different group of frequencies.
The reason I have it, is because It controls the low end of the amp and gives you extra mids (which is the key in your guitar tone in the mix)
And has been described as being more "bitey" which imo is what guitarist look for when turning up the gain. They want that crunch under their palm mutes. But you do have to compensate a little on the low end by turning it up on the amp (most often quite a bit).
Most guitarist use it as a lead boost but I leave mine on 24/7 (not really but everytime I put the amp on lol)
As I said in the previous post I want my guitar to clip the input a bit harder. So, with my amps OD channel gain on 3-5 (depending on how simpler the riffs are) I have the drive of my pedal on zero that way the pedal isn't actually giving the amp any extra drive (which compresses the signal and flattens the peaks) and we don't want that. Instead I have the level on full, that way it sends a hotter signal into the input, clipping the amp a lot hotter and giving your tone a natural overdrive. That gives you A LOT more extra bite and 'grind' without having to turn the gain up and losing clarity. So you win in that regard ?
The tone knob is more of a preferance thing. I put mine off because the Krank is fairly bright and sometimes too much as I prefer a warmer overdrive yet still crunchy and present. Listen around where the mic would be as that is what the mic is gonna pick up (don't listen too long or you'll lose your hearing lol) and then alter the tone from there.
If you're the kinda guy that turn's that contour knob (the dumbest knob on an amp imo) up on your combo amp then you prefer a more brighter sound.
Hopefully that helps ?
Niel-Roos
This is obviously a safe form of clipping right? I mean you are clipping the sound with the pedal not the amp. Becuz I pretty much busted my 30W back in the day trying to do the clipping thing like SRV ?. He just turned is volume all the way up when he first started.
Nwayz, thanks a lot for the tips, sounds like something I will definitely try soon!
deanBailey
Oh that's a different form of clipping. Amp OverDrive Is intentional clipping which causes the pleasant distortion. Clipping in the sense of Mic levels is the unpleasant type.
Malkav
I like to use .10-.46 on my RGs, I find that the higher tension feels nicer and allows me to have a lower action. As for drive levels I like to use somewhere between 60%-80% depending on venue, at home 80% because when practicing I can't really push it too far in terms of volume.
As for picking dynamics I find I pick fairly hard but sort of pull back on it when playing faster because in general when you're shredding notes are coming out so fast you can't really distinguish enough to make picking count, also I like not picking too hard because I like to have alot of dynamics in terms of tone so when I really want to dig in I want there to be an obvious difference in attack to help accentuate moments.
The really hard picking things works in a metal environment but I find that because I play anything from Metal, Jazz, Fusion,classical etc... depending on what I feel in the mood for that it wouldn't always work for me.
Still applause to Dean, I learn't quite a bit from your post on dynamics and will definitly focus in more on having a harder attack for the heavier riff moments ?
bENDER
I hope this isn't a stupid question, but if you are battling with the gauge on your 6-string guitar, why don't you get a 7 string guitar [Not that I have money to buy one..... ? ]. Won't that solve a lot of your heavy gauge problems?
I've always wanted a 7-string K-7 Ibanez, is it worth while buying one in?
deanBailey
@ bENDER: lol check my signature ?
Some people just prefer the feel of a six string and feel that a 7 is a bit too much, but still want/need low tuning because of the vocalist's pitch.
Don't like the K7, but that's just me. I just see it as an instrument someone that loves Korn would get.
There are other seven strings that are better but if you want the K7 specifically then go for it.
